[LT] Two Armor questions

[lwcamp]

Originally Posted by Anthony

For crushing weapons, a round staff is easier than a round ball which is easier than a hammer head.

I have heard it said (which means it is probably wrong wrong WRONG!) that one of the things that made hammers useful was that the pokey bits on the head bit into smooth armor, making them less likely to glance off.

Luke

[Icelander]

Originally Posted by Anthony

Having a universal 'melee combat' skill isn't entirely unreasonable; there are a number of aspects of melee combat that are basically universal (for example, understanding what your opponent might do).

Keeping time, distance and proportion. In fact, the aspect of melee combat that differ between weapons seem to me smaller and less important than the constants. Certainly, some fighters will specialise in narrow fields, but those are exceptions. A duellist who is an expert with one weapon can be represented with Optional Specialisations, Techniques and Perks. Most soldiers and warriors are not this narrowly focused.

[Polydamas]

Originally Posted by Anthony

If I swing a sword, and I misjudge range by, say, 3" (because the target moved, or I'm just not very good), I'm still probably going to hit. I might not hit for optimal effect, because I hit at the wrong point on the blade, but I'll get something. With a pick, a 3" error may mean a total miss, or a hit with the haft of the weapon, or a hit at an absolutely horrible angle on armor.

The angle thing is an issue with swings in general (and part of the reason damage is random), the "too close" thing is likely to turn into a Hook (probably on the next turn in game terms). I agree that clubs are simple, but I'm not sure that there is a huge difference in the difficulty of hitting well with maces/axes/piercing axes/picks.

Originally Posted by Anthony

Having a universal 'melee combat' skill isn't entirely unreasonable; there are a number of aspects of melee combat that are basically universal (for example, understanding what your opponent might do).

Yes, I think GURPS needs fewer weapon skills (why are Lance and Jitte/Sai their own skills?) and more defaults (an expert swordsman is no better at using an axe than a juggler with the same DX?) Its pretty clear that historical teachers believed that once you understood half a dozen sets of weapons, you could figure out how to use any other competently. The problem is that not many people have trained in multiple ways of using all manner of weapons so they could take a stab at fair defaults.

One thing to remember is that different skills cover more or less weapons. Arguably, Axe/Mace is Average because it covers everything from a 3' knobbed club to the 12" mini hatchet someone posted a link to. Some styles just don't practice some combat options. And so on ...

[Novembermike]

Melee skill probably represents a mixture of footwork, timing, understanding of distances (can I hit him, am I inside of his range, what happens if I take a step etc) and finally how exactly you hold that weapon and the motions you make with it. The last part is the only bit that really makes sense of individual weapon skills. You could probably split the melee skills into Hand To Hand (Brawling, Boxing, Karate), Wrestling (Wrestling, Judo, Sumo), Close Range (Knives, Cestus, Sai, Jitte), One Handed (Sword, Axe, Mace, Flail, Whip), Two Handed (two handed variants of the previous and staffs) and Polearm (Spear, Polearm, anything else that's longer than 2 range).

You can require techniques to use odd weapons to their full extent. Whips and Flails might suffer a stiff penalty initially that you have to buy off, fencing weapons and quarterstaffs might not give you a bonus to parry initially but allow you to buy one as a technique and you could mimic the extra training that goes into boxing or karate over brawling as buying off the individual disadvantages.

[Gudiomen]

It's also a little odd that you need two skills to use Longswords, Bastard Swords, etc... effectively.

Instead of techniques you could also have compulsory specialization, with other like skills defaulting generously.

[Verjigorm]

I work with a few guys who are either currently boxers, or used to box. We frequently have conversations about boxing, and infrequently have boxing matches after work. One day I brought in a book about medieval swordfighting, and one of my friends looked at it, nodded and then when I showed him the section on foot work, his eyes lit up.

"Looks very familiar, doesn't it?"

Some aspects of combat will always be the same, no matter if you are hitting people with sticks, poking them with spears or bashing them with your fists.