09-13-2022, 11:29 AM | #11 | ||
Join Date: Sep 2021
Location: Nar Shaddaa
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Re: [PU9] Cost of IQ under independent Will, Per, Cha
That's quite interesting, is there something similar for DEX? And trying to catch up with this, is there a book that states X skill is social or “brainy”, etc.?
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What options do they have to “compensate”? I’m just commenting on splitting alone, but you probably do something else to help things work.
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09-13-2022, 12:02 PM | #12 |
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Berkeley, CA
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Re: [PU9] Cost of IQ under independent Will, Per, Cha
The easiest solution for cost is a revealed preference model: make cost nonlinear and people will raise the attribute until it reaches a cost they're no longer willing to pay.
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09-13-2022, 06:36 PM | #13 |
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Snoopy's basement
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Re: [PU9] Cost of IQ under independent Will, Per, Cha
A problem with tracking values directly to skills is there is no residual value for generic uses of IQ. Using intermediate qualities that include relevant types of skills leaves room for non-skill uses of IQ relevant to the particular quality.
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09-14-2022, 07:06 AM | #14 | ||
Join Date: Jun 2022
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Re: [PU9] Cost of IQ under independent Will, Per, Cha
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"IQ based skills" are just IQ based. They might be modified by different Advantages (Talents and faux-Talents like Voice, CHarisma, etc), but they aren't really categorizable that simply. But, see the free pdf GURPS Fourth Edition Skill Categories for a way to split them into very overlappy skill categories. Quote:
But then I don't tend to run "low" point budget games in 4e. My lowest started at 140 points and was meant to have the PCs be at 175 by the end of the fourth session*, at which it transitioned back to a more regular rough "1 exp for every two hours of play or 5 at 'milestones", which is kinda how I give out exp. I tend to run 200-250 point starting games. * The starting was "weird" as the PCs were amnesiacs who started with 140 points in Attributes and remembered skills and advantages (and disadvantages!) as the first four sessions played out. So the first four sessions were "build a bear" sessions and introing them into the game world. Also I had two GURPS newbs, so they got to pick up a slowly expanding list of skills and advantages over 4 games sessions "organically" instead of wading through chargen all at once. Last edited by mburr0003; 09-15-2022 at 10:49 PM. |
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09-14-2022, 08:56 AM | #15 |
Join Date: Jun 2017
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Re: [PU9] Cost of IQ under independent Will, Per, Cha
If it were me, I'd price IQ at 10/level, but only because it makes conversion of templates easier.
Though I'd even more prefer to rename things and/or silo "acts as low IQ" into part of some "Animal Mind" disadvantage rather than require that animals play games with relative IQ to Per ratios.
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09-19-2022, 03:46 PM | #16 | |
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Re: [PU9] Cost of IQ under independent Will, Per, Cha
Yes.
*Basic Speed: [5] per +0.25 *Combat skills: [9] per +1 *Athletic skills: [3] per +1 *Transport skills: [2] per +1 *Sneaky skills: [1] per +1 Quote:
"nonsocial, non-technical skills that could lead to physical danger on a failure; e.g., Counterfeiting, Poisons, Shadowing, and medical skills." I should mentioned Power-Ups 9 - Alternate Attributes considered HT underpriced: *Fatigue Points: ±1 FP for [±3]; this is normally equal to the unmodified HT score *Basic Speed: ±0.25 for [±5] *HT-based skills: +1 for [1-2] *HT rolls: +1 to HT rolls [3-4] It also suggest that if you use the talent option IQ clocks in at 22 to 30 points/level. In a setting with wildcard abilities 40 to 48 points/level for IQ might be viable. Power-Ups 9 - Alternate Attributes is likely your one stop shop for fiddling around with attribute costs.
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09-19-2022, 04:01 PM | #17 | |
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Re: [PU9] Cost of IQ under independent Will, Per, Cha
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While PU9 does note using Talents as a base for an attribute's cost is a bad idea (pg 9) it does suggest that using them as a guide results in IQ being higher. As much as 30/level barring wildcard skills and changes in Will and Per.
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09-22-2022, 09:08 PM | #18 | |||
Join Date: Jun 2022
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Re: [PU9] Cost of IQ under independent Will, Per, Cha
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You could easily bump DX and IQ to 40/level each and they would still be a value over buying Talents for most Characters. Quote:
What it's very explicitly ignoring is that Talents need those associated extras to remain competitive with Attributes. Otherwise most Talents are not worth taking (arguably any Talent that costs more than 5/lvl or if you're taking more than one Talent that broadly covers a single Attribute, is no longer worth it, usually). Why? Because very few Characters have only five skills that belong to a single Attribute, and once you've exceeded ten skills in one Attribute, it's more valuable to just raise the Attribute (actually that hits at 5, or even 4 skills in one Attribute, but then Talents can play a strong price break role at that number of skills). If you're at the edge, exactly 10 skills, it's arguable either way (do not undervalue the raw DX check). But then Talents often have lower caps and a smaller cost. Quote:
And that's a lot of what Power-Ups 9 is trying to hammer home but doesn't really teach well: Figure out what Skills your campaign will be leaning hard on, and balance around those skills if you're planing to change Attribute costs. For my games splitting out Will and Per and leaving IQ untouched works, because I promote Will and Per skill usage as well as heavily indulge in Social and 'Science/Craft" skill usage. I also heavily use DX Combat and Parkour skills (which also covers HT skills). To be honest, depending on the genre, I sometimes reduce ST, because it's just not a competitive Attribute in the post-modern genres where guns hit harder and equipment weighs drastically less (c-punk and space sci-fi). And I've been doing this since 1990, so it's not exactly a new concept. |
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09-23-2022, 12:01 AM | #19 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Saskatoon, SK
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Re: [PU9] Cost of IQ under independent Will, Per, Cha
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09-23-2022, 11:54 PM | #20 | |
Join Date: Jun 2018
Location: The Wired
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Re: [PU9] Cost of IQ under independent Will, Per, Cha
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The trait qualifies you to buy IQ at a −40% limitation, just like No Fine Manipulators does for DX. |
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