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Old 04-13-2024, 08:10 AM   #1
King Leonidas
 
Join Date: Aug 2023
Default Crossbow damage making sure

so to calculate crossbow damage you do not use your own strength but you use the crossbow strength x3 for siege crossbows for example. so i think i figured it out a siege crossbow is strenght 18? so why other than range would you use this over a cherioballista that does 2d+1 instead of 1d+7 i'm guessing the certainy of the 7 damage? it's twice as heavy though

Last edited by King Leonidas; 04-13-2024 at 08:34 AM.
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Old 04-13-2024, 08:57 AM   #2
Fred Brackin
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Default Re: Crossbow damage making sure

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Originally Posted by King Leonidas View Post
so to calculate crossbow damage you do not use your own strength but you use the crossbow strength
This si the basic answer for weapons that use crossbow Skill. The only strange modifier that I can think of is the 1/2 ST for damage for the Steel crossbows in LT.

For weapons using Artillery Skill ignore any crossbow-ishness and use the stats provided. changing the require sT would chnge their weight ina way that gets ignored withCrossbow weapons.
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Old 04-13-2024, 09:14 AM   #3
King Leonidas
 
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Default Re: Crossbow damage making sure

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Originally Posted by Fred Brackin View Post
This si the basic answer for weapons that use crossbow Skill. The only strange modifier that I can think of is the 1/2 ST for damage for the Steel crossbows in LT.

For weapons using Artillery Skill ignore any crossbow-ishness and use the stats provided. changing the require sT would chnge their weight ina way that gets ignored withCrossbow weapons.
yeah no me and a friend got confused if the 1/2 strenght did not exist. then the cherioballista was the most broken weapon. in the game
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Old 04-13-2024, 09:42 AM   #4
Fred Brackin
 
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Default Re: Crossbow damage making sure

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Originally Posted by King Leonidas View Post
yeah no me and a friend got confused if the 1/2 strenght did not exist. then the cherioballista was the most broken weapon. in the game
The 1/2 ST for the steelbows exists. It represents the shortness of steelbow bolts and the lesser efficiency of such short draws.

I'm not sure i see the attraction of the Cheiroballista. It does no more damage than a Composite Crosssbow of ST14 and has less range.
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Old 04-13-2024, 10:23 AM   #5
King Leonidas
 
Join Date: Aug 2023
Default Re: Crossbow damage making sure

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Originally Posted by Fred Brackin View Post
The 1/2 ST for the steelbows exists. It represents the shortness of steelbow bolts and the lesser efficiency of such short draws.

I'm not sure i see the attraction of the Cheiroballista. It does no more damage than a Composite Crosssbow of ST14 and has less range.
the way we calcuated it wrong. was that the siege crossbow did 1d+7 damage but weighed 2 times as much. how do you make a composite crossbow of st14?
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Old 04-13-2024, 10:39 AM   #6
Varyon
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Default Re: Crossbow damage making sure

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Originally Posted by King Leonidas View Post
so to calculate crossbow damage you do not use your own strength but you use the crossbow strength x3 for siege crossbows for example. so i think i figured it out a siege crossbow is strenght 18? so why other than range would you use this over a cherioballista that does 2d+1 instead of 1d+7 i'm guessing the certainy of the 7 damage? it's twice as heavy though
Yeah, you use the ST of the crossbow. As for why to use 1d+7 over 2d+1, 1d+7 is comparable to (and becomes, if using Convert Adds to Dice) 3d. 1d+7 has an average damage of 10.5, while 2d+1 has an average damage of only 8. Also I believe you should need ST 14 (its rated ST) or higher to be able to reload the cheiroballistra in the listed 6 seconds; I'm not certain what mechanism the cheiroballistra normally uses. A belly brace would call for ST 11 to be able to cock it and I assume would increase loading time to 10 seconds (it's +4 seconds for the normal crossbows it was assumed to be used with; that's also x2, in which case applying it to the cheiroballistra would result in a 12 second load time). A winch would allow you to reload it with any ST (provided you use the right sort of winch) with the needed time depending on said ST (you can get total time for a typical crossbow by doubling the multiplier and then squaring it - x1.5 is 9 seconds, x2 is 16 seconds, etc); the cheiroballistra should take an additional 2 seconds to load compared to comparable crossbows; for ST 10, this would be 10 seconds (7.84, rounded up to 8, for the x1.4 multiplier then +2). A belt hook would call for ST 12 and reload in 9 seconds (standard crossbow takes 5 seconds to draw and cock and then 2 seconds to draw and place the bolt, for +3 seconds compared to the typical 4). A goat's foot would work for ST 10, but then you're looking at 22 seconds to reload.

Of course, one of the issues here is that the steel crossbows in LT kinda suck, thanks to only being as effective as a normal crossbow with half their listed ST. If you assume wood/composite crossbows can't get above ST 14 or so, steel crossbows are good in that, while they take longer to reload, they can actually deal more damage than a wood crossbow is physically capable of... but there are no guidelines given for how strong a wood/composite crossbow can be, and if we go with the generic MinSTx3, even the weakest crossbows can often outperform the Siege Crossbow's effective ST of 18 (pistol crossbow has MinST 7, for a maximum of 21; this works out to be a bit worse than the siege crossbow due to the pistol crossbow being only thr+2 while the siege crossbow is thr+5, and ST 21 has a thr of 2d, for 2d+2 vs 3d).
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Old 04-13-2024, 11:06 AM   #7
King Leonidas
 
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Default Re: Crossbow damage making sure

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Originally Posted by Varyon View Post
Yeah, you use the ST of the crossbow. As for why to use 1d+7 over 2d+1, 1d+7 is comparable to (and becomes, if using Convert Adds to Dice) 3d. 1d+7 has an average damage of 10.5, while 2d+1 has an average damage of only 8. Also I believe you should need ST 14 (its rated ST) or higher to be able to reload the cheiroballistra in the listed 6 seconds; I'm not certain what mechanism the cheiroballistra normally uses. A belly brace would call for ST 11 to be able to cock it and I assume would increase loading time to 10 seconds (it's +4 seconds for the normal crossbows it was assumed to be used with; that's also x2, in which case applying it to the cheiroballistra would result in a 12 second load time). A winch would allow you to reload it with any ST (provided you use the right sort of winch) with the needed time depending on said ST (you can get total time for a typical crossbow by doubling the multiplier and then squaring it - x1.5 is 9 seconds, x2 is 16 seconds, etc); the cheiroballistra should take an additional 2 seconds to load compared to comparable crossbows; for ST 10, this would be 10 seconds (7.84, rounded up to 8, for the x1.4 multiplier then +2). A belt hook would call for ST 12 and reload in 9 seconds (standard crossbow takes 5 seconds to draw and cock and then 2 seconds to draw and place the bolt, for +3 seconds compared to the typical 4). A goat's foot would work for ST 10, but then you're looking at 22 seconds to reload.

Of course, one of the issues here is that the steel crossbows in LT kinda suck, thanks to only being as effective as a normal crossbow with half their listed ST. If you assume wood/composite crossbows can't get above ST 14 or so, steel crossbows are good in that, while they take longer to reload, they can actually deal more damage than a wood crossbow is physically capable of... but there are no guidelines given for how strong a wood/composite crossbow can be, and if we go with the generic MinSTx3, even the weakest crossbows can often outperform the Siege Crossbow's effective ST of 18 (pistol crossbow has MinST 7, for a maximum of 21; this works out to be a bit worse than the siege crossbow due to the pistol crossbow being only thr+2 while the siege crossbow is thr+5, and ST 21 has a thr of 2d, for 2d+2 vs 3d).
i think we calculated it wrong. the new damage we can up with was 4d+7 i think was the right one for siege crossbow. it's 14 strenght by hand the cherioballista. and 10 to crank it.
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Old 04-13-2024, 12:55 PM   #8
Fred Brackin
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Default Re: Crossbow damage making sure

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Originally Posted by King Leonidas View Post
how do you make a composite crossbow of st14?
You take the Thrust Damage for ST 14 which is 1D. You then go to p.76 of LT. You add +5 to the Thrust Damage which is 1D+5 or 2D+1 under the usual Converting Dice and Adds rule (4 pts equals 1D, 7 pts equals 2D and so on).

You also figure range with ST 14 and the multipliers you see so it's 14 x 25 for 1/2D or 350 and 14 x 30 for Max or 420. You then take the listed weight of 7 lbs unaltered and the price of $950. So it's quite expenisve for soemthign that's only a little bit better than the stock crossbow at the same ST.
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