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Old 05-19-2012, 04:43 PM   #31
cmdicely
 
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Default Re: Surprise Rules for Animals

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Originally Posted by vicky_molokh View Post
How does Will help one quickly process a situation that is overwhelming one's comprehension to the point of stunning?
It doesn't.

If you had quickly processed the situation, you wouldn't be stunned.

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Besides, we already have Fright Checks resisted by Will.
So? We're not talking about resistance, we are talking about recovery. I don't see how that's an argument against Will as the basis for recovery from mental stun (though, since Fright Checks are a source of mental stun, one could see that as an argument in favor of Will also being the right base for recovery from mental stun.)
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Old 05-19-2012, 04:58 PM   #32
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Default Re: Surprise Rules for Animals

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Originally Posted by cmdicely View Post
It doesn't.

If you had quickly processed the situation, you wouldn't be stunned.
You still have to process it to be able to act on it.

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Originally Posted by cmdicely View Post
So? We're not talking about resistance, we are talking about recovery. I don't see how that's an argument against Will as the basis for recovery from mental stun (though, since Fright Checks are a source of mental stun, one could see that as an argument in favor of Will also being the right base for recovery from mental stun.)
I meant that it's nice to have different things resisted by different traits, not everything by one thing. (Besides, Will is really cheap and desirable.)
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Old 05-19-2012, 05:15 PM   #33
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Default Re: Surprise Rules for Animals

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You still have to process it to be able to act on it.
I don't think that recovery from overwhelming surprise and act is particularly related to generic information processing capacity modelled in GURPS by IQ distinct from its derived traits.

I think that its more related to the ability to act despite being overwhelmed (which seems an excellent fit for Will) or the ability to specifically identify actionable elements of sensory data (which GURPS models generally with Per).

Either Will, Per or even the better of Will or Per is, IMO, a better basis for recovery from surprise than IQ. I think Will is better for mental stun in general, though I could probably be convinced to go with the better of Will and Per as the general rule, too.
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Old 05-19-2012, 05:22 PM   #34
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Default Re: Surprise Rules for Animals

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I don't think that recovery from overwhelming surprise and act is particularly related to generic information processing capacity modelled in GURPS by IQ distinct from its derived traits.

I think that its more related to the ability to act despite being overwhelmed (which seems an excellent fit for Will) or the ability to specifically identify actionable elements of sensory data (which GURPS models generally with Per).

Either Will, Per or even the better of Will or Per is, IMO, a better basis for recovery from surprise than IQ. I think Will is better for mental stun in general, though I could probably be convinced to go with the better of Will and Per as the general rule, too.
Depends on the situation.
Recovery from stun lets you choose what to do and IQ seems approriate for that. If your still trying to figure it out and thus unable to act that is an IQ based stun.
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Old 05-19-2012, 05:38 PM   #35
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Default Re: Surprise Rules for Animals

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Depends on the situation.
Recovery from stun lets you choose what to do and IQ seems approriate for that. If your still trying to figure it out and thus unable to act that is an IQ based stun.
The choice thing might be key. Prey animals, when "stunned" by surprise, might be stunned by being forced to run away from the threat as directly as possible until they make an IQ check. That'll be, on the average, about 50 seconds of sprinting the heck away from danger for a critter with IQ 4.
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Old 05-19-2012, 05:42 PM   #36
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Default Re: Surprise Rules for Animals

Sort of tangential, but:

Officially, is the progression of bonuses for recovering from partial surprise +1/turn after the first until you recover, or is it +1 for second turn, and then doubled each subsequent turn until you recover?

I've always assumed it was +1/turn, but basic set just as +1, +2, "and so on", and doubling each turn also fits that and lowers the stakes (at least for partial surprise) associated with which attribute it is based on.
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Old 05-19-2012, 06:07 PM   #37
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Default Re: Surprise Rules for Animals

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The choice thing might be key. Prey animals, when "stunned" by surprise, might be stunned by being forced to run away from the threat as directly as possible until they make an IQ check. That'll be, on the average, about 50 seconds of sprinting the heck away from danger for a critter with IQ 4.
GURPS is pretty clear on what you can do when stunned though, and run like a rabbit isn't included.
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Old 05-19-2012, 06:46 PM   #38
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Default Re: Surprise Rules for Animals

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GURPS is pretty clear on what you can do when stunned though, and run like a rabbit isn't included.
Meh. This is why there's a GM.

The key thing in my mind about Stun is the loss of the player as the decision agent, and if a tweak or re-interpretation is required to basically turn a subject of many posts into a non-problem, I'll take it.
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Old 05-19-2012, 07:02 PM   #39
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Default Re: Surprise Rules for Animals

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Meh. This is why there's a GM.

The key thing in my mind about Stun is the loss of the player as the decision agent, and if a tweak or re-interpretation is required to basically turn a subject of many posts into a non-problem, I'll take it.
Yeah but seems like we have our answer to the Ops question.
Call it a perk for someone to react in a predetermined response to being surprised.
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Old 05-19-2012, 07:41 PM   #40
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Default Re: Surprise Rules for Animals

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There's a site with some very decent rules for animals, one of which is what they calls "Panic Reflexes" which is a defensive form of Combat Reflexes.

http://www.panoptesv.com/RPGs/Ads-n'-stuff/PanicR.html

There's nothing wrong with giving Combat Reflexes with a limitation "cannot be used offensively", which is pretty much what the above is.
I hate to repeat, but I've gone over this guy's stuff, and he handles this very question quite well, IMO.
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