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Old 07-23-2010, 09:04 AM   #31
Ze'Manel Cunha
 
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Default Re: REALLY Difficult Locks

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Originally Posted by Nymdok View Post
+5 : High School Padlocks, Kid's Bicycle Chain locks
+0 : Residential, Automobile Doors.
-5 : Fine Locks - Personal/Small Business Assets
Um, you're still talking about picking the lock vs. jimmying the lock, right?

If you aren't worried about hurting the lock you can jimmy it much faster than you can pick it, and for cars the issue is generally the alarm, not the lock.
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Old 07-23-2010, 09:57 AM   #32
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Default Re: REALLY Difficult Locks

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Originally Posted by Ze'Manel Cunha View Post
Um, you're still talking about picking the lock vs. jimmying the lock, right?

If you aren't worried about hurting the lock you can jimmy it much faster than you can pick it, and for cars the issue is generally the alarm, not the lock.
Im not sure exactly what you mean by 'jimmying'.

This is similar to what I had in mind for picking a basic High School padlock.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1eGxRQlWTrM

Its open at 2:22.

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Old 07-23-2010, 10:11 AM   #33
Ze'Manel Cunha
 
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Default Re: REALLY Difficult Locks

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Originally Posted by Nymdok View Post
Im not sure exactly what you mean by 'jimmying'.

This is similar to what I had in mind for picking a basic High School padlock.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1eGxRQlWTrM

Its open at 2:22.

Nymdok
That was jimmying.

It's generally the difference between making the tumblers move to the unlock position in a lock and using a credit card to push back the latch, or other brute force method to pry open a lock...
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Old 07-23-2010, 10:32 AM   #34
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Default Re: REALLY Difficult Locks

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Originally Posted by Ze'Manel Cunha View Post
That was jimmying.

It's generally the difference between making the tumblers move to the unlock position in a lock and using a credit card to push back the latch, or other brute force method to pry open a lock...
In that case, I dont separate jimmy from pick. If the lock is undamaged and open then its picked.

I would probably call the video a basic lock with improvised tools. Someone with 1 point in Lockpick and avg IQ could pick it reliably.

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Old 07-23-2010, 10:39 AM   #35
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Default Re: REALLY Difficult Locks

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In that case, I dont separate jimmy from pick. If the lock is undamaged and open then its picked.
Traditionally, 'jimmying' a lock refers to opening it with a jimmy, aka a crowbar. It often doesn't involve picking the lock at all, just damage to the door and doorframe. I wouldn't call opening a lock with a credit card jimmying.
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Old 07-23-2010, 02:30 PM   #36
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Default Re: REALLY Difficult Locks

I've asked this before, but why exactly do you think that equipment quality is open ended?
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Old 07-23-2010, 02:59 PM   #37
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Default Re: REALLY Difficult Locks

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I've asked this before, but why exactly do you think that equipment quality is open ended?
I dont present this table as one to be applied to equipment across the board.

The idea of a skill 15 having a 50/50 shot of picking Fort Knox in an hour just didnt sit well with me.

I was unhappy with the idea that locks (in high tech) only come in 5,0,-5. It seemed kind of unsatisfying being so discrete, and since you and i had freshly dissagreed on the subject in the other thread, I figured I'd noodle over it and see what I got for my troubles.

I started to think about what kind of lock difficulty would be tough for someone with a Lockpick skill of 25, and , not so much what that lock might be like (Im not a locksmith myself), but who would use that lock and be able to afford it. Thats where I came up with the idea of -20 (Which I then reduced down to -15 based on your TL suggestion)

Then I went the other way and asked whats simpler than a basic lock? novelty handcuffs and slotted bathroom doorlocks came to mind and I thought, could someone, even a particularly dense someone, pick this lock? I figure someone with IQ 9 could pick it with certainty.

From there, I fit a curve to the data using the listed cost modifiers a few different ways (as seen in the first post) and found numbers that I thought were smooth and reasonable. Then we wound up here :)

To address directly your question about the quality of lockpicking equipment, As I said above, Im going to stick to the +2, with a few possible exceptions (Lockpick gun for Basic Locks +4, Maybe even a Slim Jim for car doors +4?).

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Old 07-23-2010, 03:20 PM   #38
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Default Re: REALLY Difficult Locks

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Maybe even a Slim Jim for car doors +4?
Isn't a Slim Jim more like forced entry?

At any rate Id be interested to know why HANS did it the way he did in the first place.
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Old 07-23-2010, 03:38 PM   #39
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Default Re: REALLY Difficult Locks

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Isn't a Slim Jim more like forced entry?

At any rate Id be interested to know why HANS did it the way he did in the first place.
Ususally when I see a slim jim used, its a thin piece of ridgid metal tha may have notches on the end that is slid down between the Window Glass and Door. Its then hooked on the locking mechanisim and pulled in such a way that the lock is manually moved into the unlocked position. There is no damage done to the car, the lock, or the door mechanisim.

Id be curious too. PM Him?

EDIT:PMed him.

Edit Edit: Slim Jim

Nymdok

Last edited by Nymdok; 07-23-2010 at 03:47 PM.
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Old 07-23-2010, 03:40 PM   #40
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Default Re: REALLY Difficult Locks

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Originally Posted by sir_pudding View Post
I've asked this before, but why exactly do you think that equipment quality is open ended?
Because skill is open ended? Realistically, there's an upper limit to both, and with current technology the upper limit to non-forcible lockpicking is lower than the upper limit on lock quality.
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