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Old 12-23-2021, 10:10 AM   #11
phiwum
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Boston area
Default Re: Do Wizards Pay Money To Learn New Spells?

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Originally Posted by Steve Plambeck View Post
Why couldn't a player:

(1) create a new wizard PC with a high IQ, who knows the spells your other PC wizards are hoping to eventually learn

(2) give that new wizard a strong passion for teaching and passing on her knowledge

(3) keep that new wizard out of the main action as much as possible

(4) you probably see where I'm going with this
There's nothing to keep a player from this, just like there's nothing to keep a player from making a wizard who can enchant weapons or a master armourer who is just a cheap source of fine weapons and armor, if the GM allows a player to have several characters (as I do). Well, there's nothing aside from the GM's discretion.

I allow a stable of characters per player so that they can pick and choose who goes on an adventure and they have fill-ins when someone is taken out of action. However, I place limits on how many characters a player can have at one time (with a character or two in the pocket to fill in for lost characters in adventures far from home). I also don't allow any aid from characters not explicitly in the adventure.

Neither of these rules explicitly prevent the handy support character who never adventures and provides services between adventures. You could force such characters into adventures on occasion, but the better solution is just not to allow them. PCs are meant to go on adventures, not be servants to the big guys. I just wouldn't go for this kind of tomfoolery.
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Old 12-23-2021, 10:21 AM   #12
Shostak
 
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Default Re: Do Wizards Pay Money To Learn New Spells?

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Originally Posted by Axly Suregrip View Post
The bottom line for me is, can you make this (costs in $ and/or time for acquiring spells) a hook to adventures? If not, then it is unnecessary bookkeeping that takes your players away from the adventure.
Exactly so. The same holds true for learning talents, of course. It is so much better if the players work in how they are acquiring new skills, be they normal or magical.
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Old 12-23-2021, 12:34 PM   #13
Shaira
 
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Default Re: Do Wizards Pay Money To Learn New Spells?

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Originally Posted by Axly Suregrip View Post
The bottom line for me is, can you make this (costs in $ and/or time for acquiring spells) a hook to adventures? If not, then it is unnecessary bookkeeping that takes your players away from the adventure.
Obviously, yes. However, I'm trying to grok what the rules-as-written say about the subject, and whether I'm missing anything. Just to understand how the TFT written rules imply wizards operate. :)
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Old 12-23-2021, 12:50 PM   #14
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Default Re: Do Wizards Pay Money To Learn New Spells?

The guidance is at ITL 144: "The GM may instead require wizards to find a teacher for each new spell..."
This is after learning spells from books.
My question is: Do you need a chest or lab to apply book studies to learning a new spell?
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Last edited by hcobb; 12-23-2021 at 01:07 PM.
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Old 12-23-2021, 05:10 PM   #15
Steve Plambeck
 
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Default Re: Do Wizards Pay Money To Learn New Spells?

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Originally Posted by phiwum View Post
There's nothing to keep a player from this... [snip] I allow a stable of characters per player so that they can pick and choose who goes on an adventure [snip] Neither of these rules explicitly prevent the handy support character who never adventures and provides services between adventures. You could force such characters into adventures on occasion, but the better solution is just not to allow them. PCs are meant to go on adventures, not be servants to the big guys. I just wouldn't go for this kind of tomfoolery.
I'd make the character go on a first adventure -- nobody actually exists until they've appeared in actual play at least once, or so I'd rule. After that if they were always left at home, I'd have the party return from an adventure one day only to find them kidnapped or missing, and that would be the hook for the next session. My group always kept this part simple though, letting a wizard take a new spell as soon as they increased IQ, just assuming it was the thing they'd been studying.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hcobb View Post
The guidance is at ITL 144: "The GM may instead require wizards to find a teacher for each new spell..."
This is after learning spells from books.
My question is: Do you need a chest or lab to apply book studies to learning a new spell?
If I had to pick (which I don't) I'd be inclined to say it should take less time to learn a new spell from a teacher rather than it being self-taught from a book.
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Old 12-24-2021, 01:50 AM   #16
Shaira
 
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Default Re: Do Wizards Pay Money To Learn New Spells?

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Originally Posted by hcobb View Post
My question is: Do you need a chest or lab to apply book studies to learning a new spell?
My gut tells me no.

- Yes, you need a chest or lab to research a new spell.
- Yes, you need a chest or lab to cast a spell from a book.
- No, you don't need a chest or lab to learn a spell from a book (or teacher).

Unless the book you're learning from is in your own home, though, you are going to need to think about room and board. IMHO the Wizards' Guild will provide room and board for "free", ie in return for some small chores while you're staying and also because you're already paying 1% dues per month. So that means you can study at the guild house "library", or with a guild teacher (you may end up paying this latter additional fees).

If you're *not* in the Wizards' Guild, obviously all bets are off and you could end up paying heftily. In that case you probably want to buy a magic book and hole up somewhere to study.

All IMHO of course. :)

Cheers,

Sarah
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Old 12-24-2021, 05:08 PM   #17
amenditman
 
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Default Re: Do Wizards Pay Money To Learn New Spells?

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Originally Posted by Shaira View Post
IMHO the Wizards' Guild will provide room and board for "free", ie in return for some small chores while you're staying and also because you're already paying 1% dues per month. So that means you can study at the guild house "library", or with a guild teacher (you may end up paying this latter additional fees).

If you're *not* in the Wizards' Guild, obviously all bets are off and you could end up paying heftily. In that case you probably want to buy a magic book and hole up somewhere to study.

All IMHO of course. :)

Cheers,

Sarah
I'm thinking of a non-adventuring 'average' wizard, how much do they make, what is 1% of that?
Journeyman IQ 10 Pay $30/wk 1% = $0.3
Town Wizard IQ 15 Pay $120/wk 1% = $1.2

I do not believe that gains you 'free' room and board. Perhaps just access to adequate room and board at very cheap rates, access to the library, and mostly guaranteed ability to hire services at a discount.

Non-members would be looked at as if they were criminals and would need to have very enticing reasons to be knocking on the Guild's doors.
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Old 12-24-2021, 05:42 PM   #18
hcobb
 
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Default Re: Do Wizards Pay Money To Learn New Spells?

ITL 60 "the Guild does not claim a monopoly on this service, as it does on teaching spells."
Whenever I've run the numbers on the services SJ claims that the WG provides I've seen just barely how to do it, given overwhelming popular support for the guild.
https://www.hcobb.com/tft/wizards_dran.html
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