Question - can dice be required on low-risk moves?

[Werdna]

Like the title says, can dice be required for low-risk moves that end up overlapping terrain/hazards? The rulebook says (p.12) that no dice are rolled for low-risk moves, and no ace tokens are gained. That could make sense even for bumpy terrain, since the driver is not turning, but probably not for spikes or other things that could cause tire damage.

A little before that it says (p.12) that a driving roll consists of the following, (suggesting the maneuver dice are a subset of a total dice pool roll): ​

- blue terrain dice
- hazard dice
- maneuver dice (if applicable)

So is it right to interpret the no dice from low-risk move as only applying to the third bullet on the list? So for example, if I'm driving at speed 3 straight into terrain 2 and stopping on terrain 2 and spikes, would it then require 2 blue dice (terrain), 2 black dice (spikes), but no other dice, and would not grant an ace token?

Thanks!

[PresidentTwoeagles]

Originally Posted by Werdna

Like the title says, can dice be required for low-risk moves that end up overlapping terrain/hazards? The rulebook says (p.12) that no dice are rolled for low-risk moves, and no ace tokens are gained. That could make sense even for bumpy terrain, since the driver is not turning, but probably not for spikes or other things that could cause tire damage.

A little before that it says (p.12) that a driving roll consists of the following, (suggesting the maneuver dice are a subset of a total dice pool roll): ​

- blue terrain dice
- hazard dice
- maneuver dice (if applicable)

So is it right to interpret the no dice from low-risk move as only applying to the third bullet on the list? So for example, if I'm driving at speed 3 straight into terrain 2 and stopping on terrain 2 and spikes, would it then require 2 blue dice (terrain), 2 black dice (spikes), but no other dice, and would not grant an ace token?

Thanks!

Correct. If you're driving straight or slight turn, you do not roll maneuver dice and you do not gain an ace token. But you can roll for either terrain or hazards if those are applicable. You always roll against whatever your car is over at the END of the movement.

Also remember that if you are out of control and moving, those rolls still need to be made. Any shields are converted to tire damage, and if your tires are 0, they do nothing.

[Werdna]

OK, cool. Thanks! That makes sense.

[Yenaldlooshi]

Originally Posted by PresidentTwoeagles

Correct. If you're driving straight or slight turn, you do not roll maneuver dice and you do not gain an ace token. But you can roll for either terrain or hazards if those are applicable. You always roll against whatever your car is over at the END of the movement.

Also remember that if you are out of control and moving, those rolls still need to be made. Any shields are converted to tire damage, and if your tires are 0, they do nothing.

"at the END of movement" indicates that if I can completely traverse a hazard or higher level terrain in the movement of a movement point, then I don't need to roll against it if I am not sitting on it at the end of that movement point, correct?

[beetle496]

Originally Posted by PresidentTwoeagles

…If you're driving straight or slight turn, you do not roll maneuver dice and you do not gain an ace token.

Straight, no Ace token. But I thought slight turn and slide were both no roll, but one Ace token?

[HeatDeath]

Originally Posted by Yenaldlooshi

"at the END of movement" indicates that if I can completely traverse a hazard or higher level terrain in the movement of a movement point, then I don't need to roll against it if I am not sitting on it at the end of that movement point, correct?

This is correct.

[Sam Mitschke]

A slide is a D0 maneuver that nets you an ace token. A slight turn is NOT a maneuver and therefore does not provide you an ace token (it's meant for very minute adjustments and serves as the "fudge" range allowed for car positioning for folks with shaky hands, like me).

For what it's worth, here is the way I now teach driving rolls, and how I would revise the rulebook for a 2nd printing:

A driving roll is required at the end of every movement point. When you have fully spent a movement point, check the requirements for your driving roll:

1) Add a number of [blue dice] equal to the highest-level terrain beneath the rectangle on your car base. If you are overlapping multiple terrain levels, only add dice for the highest level —*terrain effects are not combined.

2) Add any dice indicated by all hazards beneath the rectangle on your car base. Unlike terrain, hazard effects are cumulative, so when overlapping multiple hazards, they all affect your driving roll.

Note that some hazards (Oil, for example) do not add dice to your driving roll, but have effects that apply to the end result of your driving roll.

3) Add any dice required by the difficulty of the maneuver you just completed. If your intended maneuver was shortened (by a collision, for example), only add dice for the difficulty of the maneuver you actually performed.

Note that driving straight and slight turns are not maneuvers, so they do not contribute to your driving roll.

4) Roll all required dice and resolve any re-rolls you may have available.

5) Add any effects required by hazard cards. This leaves you with the final result of your driving roll, which you must then resolve (see Maneuvering Results).

It is possible that your driving roll consists of zero dice and no effects. In this case, the driving roll is resolved and you can move on.

[baakyocalder]

Originally Posted by Sam Mitschke

A slide is a D0 maneuver that nets you an ace token. A slight turn is NOT a maneuver and therefore does not provide you an ace token (it's meant for very minute adjustments and serves as the "fudge" range allowed for car positioning for folks with shaky hands, like me).

For what it's worth, here is the way I now teach driving rolls, and how I would revise the rulebook for a 2nd printing:

A driving roll is required at the end of every movement point. When you have fully spent a movement point, check the requirements for your driving roll:

1) Add a number of [blue dice] equal to the highest-level terrain beneath the rectangle on your car base. If you are overlapping multiple terrain levels, only add dice for the highest level —*terrain effects are not combined.

2) Add any dice indicated by all hazards beneath the rectangle on your car base. Unlike terrain, hazard effects are cumulative, so when overlapping multiple hazards, they all affect your driving roll.

Note that some hazards (Oil, for example) do not add dice to your driving roll, but have effects that apply to the end result of your driving roll.

3) Add any dice required by the difficulty of the maneuver you just completed. If your intended maneuver was shortened (by a collision, for example), only add dice for the difficulty of the maneuver you actually performed.

Note that driving straight and slight turns are not maneuvers, so they do not contribute to your driving roll.

4) Roll all required dice and resolve any re-rolls you may have available.

5) Add any effects required by hazard cards. This leaves you with the final result of your driving roll, which you must then resolve (see Maneuvering Results).

It is possible that your driving roll consists of zero dice and no effects. In this case, the driving roll is resolved and you can move on.

This would be excellent for an FAQ or errata sheet.

[Sam Mitschke]

@baakyocalder
Agreed, and thank you. It's a little tough because this is technically a rather substantial change to the rules-as-written, but I'm working on it. This is pretty much the exact wording I intend to use, though.

[beetle496]

I also agree that this is good candidate for FAQ or errata, as the readability is better, and the play logic tracks nicely.

Originally Posted by Sam Mitschke

It's a little tough because this is technically a rather substantial change to the rules-as-written, but I'm working on it. This is pretty much the exact wording I intend to use, though.

I get that this is a significant rewrite — since the word count is high — but is it actually a change to RAW? If so, please point the play difference, because I have missed it! It seems to me to be the same rules, just easier to follow?