[Psi] Powers (basic set)

[Dalillama]

In the Basic Set, Detect lists Injuries and Diseases as possibilities, and in the Psi section, these are listed as part of the Healing power. Nowhere in the basic set does it say what the effect of these powers is, though. Do they replace Diagnosis? Offer a bonus? Would it offer a bonus to Physician or First Aid? Something else? I realize that these questions and more are probably answered in Powers and/or Psionic Powers, but I have neither, nor a gaming budget ATM.

[lexington]

Originally Posted by Dalillama

In the Basic Set, Detect lists Injuries and Diseases as possibilities, and in the Psi section, these are listed as part of the Healing power. Nowhere in the basic set does it say what the effect of these powers is, though. Do they replace Diagnosis? Offer a bonus? Would it offer a bonus to Physician or First Aid? Something else? I realize that these questions and more are probably answered in Powers and/or Psionic Powers, but I have neither, nor a gaming budget ATM.

I'm not sure what the question is. An injury or disease means what it means, being stabbed is an injury and having a cold is a disease (there may be other examples).

Detect (Injury and Disease) lets you detect injuries and diseases, exactly as described for the Detect advantage. I believe you can justify getting a bonus to certain skills via Detect if you roll against IQ+Talent, Diagnosis should get +4 I think since Detect provide miraculous assistance. I'd require certain enhancements for them to be useful to Physician.

Healing lets you heal people using the rules listed for the Healing advantage.

[Dalillama]

Originally Posted by lexington

I'm not sure what the question is. An injury or disease means what it means, being stabbed is an injury and having a cold is a disease (there may be other examples).

The question was whether Detect (Disease and/or poison) would replace Diagnosis for the purposes of determining what was wrong with someone, since Diagnosis is the skill of identifying a disease, which Detect would seem to override. Similarly, Detect (Injury) should, in principle, allow the location of internal injuries, which would ordinarily be a Diagnosis roll at a serious penalty. So I was inquiring what, per the rules, the interaction between Detect (Medical problems) or some subset would be with skills such as Diagnosis. I can certainly see the +4 to Diagnosis being fair, although I would suppose that this would entirely replace equipment modifiers, positive or negative, rather than being added to them.

Originally Posted by lexington

Healing lets you heal people using the rules listed for the Healing advantage.

Quite. However, there is a power group called Psychic Healing (B256), which includes, as powers eligible for that power modifier, both Healing and Detect (disease, poison, etc). All of the other powers have specified game mechanics, but it is not clear to me what the precise RAW benefit of this form of Detect, specifically, especially as it related to mundane medical skills.


Relating to the Healing power, what might people consider a fair discount for the limitation "cannot heal more than 3 HP per use," with the ordinary rules for repeated attempts on the same person? I figure probably somewhere between -5-10% is probably about right. Also, I'm pretty sure there's a rule somewhere about using a skill roll instead of/in addition to an attribute+talent roll. Am I correct in my understanding that using a Hard skill in place of an attribute roll is a 0% modifier? What, if anything, would a modifier that required a skill roll first be worth? e.g., if a character can only attempt to use the Healing power after making a separate Diagnosis roll, is that a limitation, or just a feature?

[David Johnston2]

I'd suggest using Diagnosis as the controlling skill for a Detect Disease in the first place, same as using Interrogation for Mind Probe.

[Sunrunners_Fire]

Aura Reading, GURPS Psionic Powers, pg 46 ... would answer some of that.

In practice?

Detect feeds you three levels of information.

Detect.Sense
Detect.BasicAnalysis
Detect.DetailedAnalysis

Detect.Sense tells you if it is there and how much of it is there.

Detect.BasicAnalysis tells you the details obtainable via observation. Applied to Detect (Humans), per Aura Reading, above, this acts as a successful Diagnosis check in addition to informing you how many HP and FP they have remaining, if they have any diseases or other infections and their vague emotional state.

Detect.DetailedAnalysis requires the Analyzing enhancement from Powers and gives you the details obtainable via intensive testing and lab work. Applied to Detect (Humans), this tells you the specific disease names, information on subtle, long-term problems and as much detail as the Emotion Sense ability would give. (Empathy, essentially) This counts as a full battery of lab tests, including medical imaging, for all purposes.

All of these information levels allow you to continue monitoring the subject without any additional concentration required.

As such?

Detect (Disease) gives you Detect.Sense for the presence or absence of diseases and a rough estimation of how diseased they are while Detect.BasicAnalysis would count as a successful disease-related Diagnosis check.

[Dalillama]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

I'd suggest using Diagnosis as the controlling skill for a Detect Disease in the first place, same as using Interrogation for Mind Probe.

AFAICT the Healing advantage as written doesn't require the use of Detect or Diagnosis beforehand, and allows you to heal someone even if you don't know what's wrong with them at all.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by Dalillama

AFAICT the Healing advantage as written doesn't require the use of Detect or Diagnosis beforehand, and allows you to heal someone even if you don't know what's wrong with them at all.

Sure. There's no reason you couldn't just have the Healing ability. That's different from having a bunch of abilities (Detect, Healing, Afflictions) as part of a Healing power.

[lexington]

Originally Posted by Dalillama

The question was whether Detect (Disease and/or poison) would replace Diagnosis for the purposes of determining what was wrong with someone, since Diagnosis is the skill of identifying a disease, which Detect would seem to override. Similarly, Detect (Injury) should, in principle, allow the location of internal injuries, which would ordinarily be a Diagnosis roll at a serious penalty. So I was inquiring what, per the rules, the interaction between Detect (Medical problems) or some subset would be with skills such as Diagnosis.

I think you'd need Precise to find particular injuries, although some of the examples in Powers make me think that Using Skills With Powers allows a pretty generous interpretation of what you can do.

Originally Posted by Dalillama

I can certainly see the +4 to Diagnosis being fair, although I would suppose that this would entirely replace equipment modifiers, positive or negative, rather than being added to them.

No, it adds to them but Detect won't provide a flat bonus. You have to roll for it so there's a chance of failure.

Originally Posted by Dalillama

All of the other powers have specified game mechanics, but it is not clear to me what the precise RAW benefit of this form of Detect, specifically, especially as it related to mundane medical skills.

It helps you find where disease and injury is, just like Detect (Gold) helps you find gold. With Analyzing you can justify a bonus to Diagnosis with a successful IQ+Talent roll. A person trying to track the progress of a plague would benefit a great deal from having Detect (Disease) if they can personally walk through a city.

Originally Posted by Dalillama

Also, I'm pretty sure there's a rule somewhere about using a skill roll instead of/in addition to an attribute+talent roll.

In Powers, yes.

Originally Posted by Dalillama

Am I correct in my understanding that using a Hard skill in place of an attribute roll is a 0% modifier?

I don't recall if that's RAW or just commonly accepted.

Originally Posted by Dalillama

What, if anything, would a modifier that required a skill roll first be worth? e.g., if a character can only attempt to use the Healing power after making a separate Diagnosis roll, is that a limitation, or just a feature?

Fairly little, I believe. Fickle, from Powers, drops to -5% (ish, I don't have the book in front of me) if you get to roll for with with normal benefits.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by lexington

I don't recall if that's RAW or just commonly accepted.

It's the basis of Skills for Everyone.

[Dalillama]

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

Sure. There's no reason you couldn't just have the Healing ability. That's different from having a bunch of abilities (Detect, Healing, Afflictions) as part of a Healing power.

Yes. The question was, if someone has the advantage Healing, how much of a limitation, if any, would it be if they needed to succeed at a Diagnosis roll before being able to make a Healing roll.

Originally Posted by lexington

I think you'd need Precise to find particular injuries, although some of the examples in Powers make me think that Using Skills With Powers allows a pretty generous interpretation of what you can do.

unfortunately, I haven't got that book.

No, it adds to them but Detect won't provide a flat bonus. You have to roll for it so there's a chance of failure.

Right; a successful Detect check gives a flat +4 to a subsequent Diagnosis roll

It helps you find where disease and injury is, just like Detect (Gold) helps you find gold. With Analyzing you can justify a bonus to Diagnosis with a successful IQ+Talent roll. A person trying to track the progress of a plague would benefit a great deal from having Detect (Disease) if they can personally walk through a city.

This appears to conflict with what you said in post 2, and also what Sunrunner's Fire said in post 5

Fairly little, I believe. Fickle, from Powers, drops to -5% (ish, I don't have the book in front of me) if you get to roll for with with normal benefits.

About what I figured.