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Old 01-13-2019, 06:46 PM   #141
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Default Re: Modern Monster Hunting Guns [XM500, MICOR Leader 50, etc.]

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Originally Posted by Icelander View Post
They'd want both high-quality grenade fuzes and fuzes to make the equivalent of Claymore anti-personnel mines.
Claymore fuses are easy - they're an electrical command-triggered detonator, and thast's something common in mining and demolitions.

A grenade fuse like a WWI/II German 'potato masher' grenade is fairly simple (Explosives (Fireworks) would do nicely). The striker activated timers on something like the M67 would need the services of a clock-maker or armourer, and a machinist as well.
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What kind of equipment do you need to manufacture fuzes? And is any of it so controlled that it cannot be legally bought through mining companies, construction companies or anything other than huge defense contractors?

If proper fuzes cannot be made outside of the Top Secret laboratories of defence contractors like Lockheed-Martin or Northrop-Grumman, then they'd have to acquire ordnance on the black market. Firework style fuzes are not an option.
Some of the chemicals used in making fuses might be difficult to obtain in bulk, but if you're hand-making limited numbers of fuses, I don't think that would be a real problem.
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Old 01-13-2019, 06:47 PM   #142
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Default Re: Modern Monster Hunting Guns [XM500, MICOR Leader 50, etc.]

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Good as original fuzes for hand grenades should be makeable with simple tools and modest chemistry.

Pull the pin and release the spoon and a spring causes a lever to strike a percussion cap. That ignites a 4-5 second pyrotechnic fuze. That sets off an equivalent to a commercial blasting cap and the filler goes "Boom".

The German system used in WWI and II used a pull-string connected to a friction igniter that lit a pyrotechnic trail.

When working on grenade myths the Mythbusters tended to use decommissioned grenade bodies re-filled with C4.
Aside from engineer or technician at a defense contractor firm, what would be plausible backgrounds for someone who could (with access to a checkbook and contacts within any of Kessler's companies necessary) set up a boutique bombmaking workshop where he manufactured unlicensed copies of military grenades, mines and other ordnance useful for monster hunting?

Some kind of chemist and if so, with what kind of resume?

Some variation of engineer? Which kind and what civilian jobs could he have had where he grew familiar with fuzes, explosives and running a workshop?

I'm tempted to create an NPC with a background in movie pyrotechnics, explosive stunts and practical special effects. Could someone learn the necessary skill set in Hollywood?

Perhaps if they were a military demolition expert who went into the entertainment industry after a stint in uniform...
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Old 01-13-2019, 07:09 PM   #143
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Default Re: Modern Monster Hunting Guns [XM500, MICOR Leader 50, etc.]

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I'm tempted to create an NPC with a background in movie pyrotechnics, explosive stunts and practical special effects. Could someone learn the necessary skill set in Hollywood?
I don't know that this would teach you to make fuses. It occurs to me that having a company that does movie pyrotechnics would be a great front for acquiring all sorts of fuses that would be useable in the sorts of explosives you want. They wouldn't be milspec, but as the people using them are highly trained and not conscripts, etc., this shouldn't be too much of a problem - they can be trusted to take care of stuff that they're warned might not handle serious abuse.
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Old 01-14-2019, 12:38 AM   #144
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Default Re: Modern Monster Hunting Guns [XM500, MICOR Leader 50, etc.]

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I don't know that this would teach you to make fuses. It occurs to me that having a company that does movie pyrotechnics would be a great front for acquiring all sorts of fuses that would be useable in the sorts of explosives you want. They wouldn't be milspec, but as the people using them are highly trained and not conscripts, etc., this shouldn't be too much of a problem - they can be trusted to take care of stuff that they're warned might not handle serious abuse.
That's a good point. As long as there exists a viable way to purchase professionally made fuzes through some kind of cover, there shouldn't be a need to make them 'at home'.

Yes, the people using them should in almost all cases be highly trained. The only exceptions would be those few Monster Hunters with mystical abilities useful enough in the field so that they are made members of the hunter team without a background in military SOF.

A case in point is Lucien Lacoste (PC), who was Jesuit-educated, contemplated a vocation in the priesthood and instead went into the New Orleans PD after college. The Monster Hunters want him because he is a powerful, instinctive medium and has a talent for magic dealing with spirits and various otherworldly beings, but Lacoste has no military experience at all. On the other hand, Lacoste did spend a couple of years in the NOPD Special Operations Division, including a stint in a Tactical Platoon (NOPD's SWAT) and another in the Violent Offender Warrant Squad.

Lacoste doesn't really lack combat skills, indeed, as an amateur MMA fighter and skilled three-gun IPSC shooter, as well as a former SWAT officer, he's actually pretty capable, but he has never used fragmentation grenades, anti-personnel mines or other military ordnance.
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Old 01-14-2019, 12:49 AM   #145
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Default Re: Modern Monster Hunting Guns [XM500, MICOR Leader 50, etc.]

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Lacoste doesn't really lack combat skills, indeed, as an amateur MMA fighter and skilled three-gun IPSC shooter, as well as a former SWAT officer, he's actually pretty capable, but he has never used fragmentation grenades, anti-personnel mines or other military ordnance.
His background does mean that he should be used to handling expensive pieces of field equipment that, while not fragile, can't just be tossed in the dirt or thrown into the back of a truck though. That would be, to me, the main concern with explosive devices made with non-standard parts - that they wouldn't stand the abuse that a well-made military issue grenade, claymore, etc. can. Now, until the fuses are put in, this just means unusable kit, but you need to put the fuses into your hand grenades before you go out after the monsters, so things could get exciting if people are rough with their grenades.

BTW, one advantage of making grenades rather than buying them is being able to do nice things like use silver wire in the fragmentation coil, to give those naughty werewolves something extra to think about.
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Old 01-14-2019, 12:53 AM   #146
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Default Making Grenades, Explosive Ammunition, Mines, etc.

In realistic terms*, what skill sets do you need to make unlicensed copies of fragmentation grenades, grenade launcher ammunition, Claymore mines and various explosive ordnance?

Assume that the unit armorer has high levels of Armoury (Small Arms) and decent levels of Armoury (Heavy Weapons), from having worked on personal weapons and been responsible for maintenance of the sort of support weapons that an SAS unit might see. After retiring, he'd have become a custom gunsmith, which doesn't seem like it would add anything to his skills in terms of handling explosive ordnance, though he is an expert handloader.

Several others have Armoury (Small Arms) and one PC is actually a highly skilled machinist, smith, armourer and mechanic, with skill 15+ in several fields, but after he learned magic from the Nommo, he is at a disadvantage working with high technology.

Assume also that the services of professional machinists, marine engineers and technicians can be assumed, as needed, with Machinist and relevant Mechanic specialties at 15+.

Several team members have Explosives (Demolitions) and at least two have it at skill 15+. Engineer (Combat) at 12+ is at least one character.

What other skills are required?

*I.e. with more complexity than a standard MH game might apply.
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Old 01-14-2019, 01:03 AM   #147
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Default Re: Modern Monster Hunting Guns [XM500, MICOR Leader 50, etc.]

I don't see a major issue with the frag grenades. The go-to skill for the interior filling and setting them up would be Explosives (Fireworks) - they are just a pyrotechnic, after all. The casing would probably be machinist, or mechanic. I'd make the casing by winding wire into a cylinder, pre-scoring it (get the help to do that - it's tedious), and then imbedding that into a casing cast from epoxy or the like. The grenades would all be cylindrical (like most smoke grenades), so you'd want each type to have a distinctive surface - say smooth for smoke, heavily notched for Frag, and so on.

Claymore mines, same deal but with small ball bearing balls encased in the front of the casing. These are probably the easiest of the lot to make.

Grenade launcher ammo and things like that are the hard jobs. The cases and the loading is easy enough, but the projectiles will be a real pain. Worse, the fuses for such things are very tricky to make and are a specialised item. These are the sort of thing it's probably easiest to just buy/steal pre-made.
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Old 01-14-2019, 01:32 AM   #148
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Default Re: Modern Monster Hunting Guns [XM500, MICOR Leader 50, etc.]

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His background does mean that he should be used to handling expensive pieces of field equipment that, while not fragile, can't just be tossed in the dirt or thrown into the back of a truck though. That would be, to me, the main concern with explosive devices made with non-standard parts - that they wouldn't stand the abuse that a well-made military issue grenade, claymore, etc. can. Now, until the fuses are put in, this just means unusable kit, but you need to put the fuses into your hand grenades before you go out after the monsters, so things could get exciting if people are rough with their grenades.
Heh. Lacoste is notoriously tough on kit. Previously, this was due to him being impatient with pettifogging bean-counting bureaucrats and more concerned with 'results' than avoiding scratches on expensive pieces of equipment, but after he started exhibiting magical abilities, advanced technology seems to actively hate him.

The more complicated technology is, the worse it is around him. Anything late TL8, reliant on all sorts of digital gizmos, just keeps failing around him (-2 to his skills primarily used through such equipment, reduce Malf., at least by at least -2 for such gear). To a lesser degree, any electronics are wonky around him and even TL7 gear that is not simply a refinement of older principles is not as reliable around him as with other people.

As far as anyone can tell, this is standard with magic workers and those with supernatural gifts, with the severity dependent to some degree on how much supernatural power to affect the external world the magician regularly handles. Lacoste is powerful, if mostly limited to affecting spiritual matters, and while he exhibits less dramatic effects on technology around him than true archmages, he'll still be a lot less safer around any sort of delicate fuzes and explosives than the majority of the Monster Hunters, who are occult-aware rather than having any magical gifts themselves.

Whatever is the least complicated type of fuze that is still reliable enough will be the only thing Lacoste is even allowed near. Nothing relying on principles that weren't understood by WWII and ideally, something that was regarded as tried-and-true technology even back then.

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BTW, one advantage of making grenades rather than buying them is being able to do nice things like use silver wire in the fragmentation coil, to give those naughty werewolves something extra to think about.
Indeed.

This is why, even if the Monster Hunters might be able to acquire ordnance on the black market, I want to know what skill sets are required to break standard gear into components and make esoteric versions.
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Old 01-14-2019, 01:36 AM   #149
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Default Re: Modern Monster Hunting Guns [XM500, MICOR Leader 50, etc.]

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Whatever is the least complicated type of fuze that is still reliable enough will be the only thing Lacoste is even allowed near. Nothing relying on principles that weren't understood by WWII and ideally, something that was regarded as tried-and-true technology even back then.
Well, you basic hand grenade fuse hasn't really changed since before WWII, and thus a modern TL8 hand grenade fuse is still just a refined TL6 device. He should be safe enough with those.
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Old 01-14-2019, 02:29 AM   #150
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Default Re: Modern Monster Hunting Guns [XM500, MICOR Leader 50, etc.]

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Well, you basic hand grenade fuse hasn't really changed since before WWII, and thus a modern TL8 hand grenade fuse is still just a refined TL6 device. He should be safe enough with those.
Well, safe-ish.

Even if his magic doesn't interfere with the Malf. (which it still might if he really lets loose with magic, at least for a -1 penalty), he is still Impulsive, Overconfident and On the Edge. If the Monster Hunters had proper psych screening*, he would not be allowed near anything that can be dangerous, let alone high explosives.

Ah, PCs. The kind of teammate that NPC professionals are afflicted with as a curse from a malevolent universe.

Eh, it's not as if real adventuring occultists are so plentiful that you can afford to turn them down just because they are dangerous crazy persons. In any case, if you did that, you'd never have anyone who could work magic on your side, as it seems they are all more or less cuckoo for Cocoa Puffs, especially the powerful ones.

*Ironically, they do have quite extensive screening protocols and several mental health professionals are involved in the process. It's just that the final vote belongs with an eccentric centenarian who might give more weight to signs and portents than a pscych profile saying that someone is a danger to himself and others. And scrawl on the report from the psychiatrist: "Danger to himself and others precisely the point. JRK."
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