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Old 09-13-2015, 03:43 PM   #1
jj234
 
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Default When to homebrew and when to use the system?

A common phrase heard when people talk about GURPS is 'You can make anything'. This is a tall order, but I bought the system anyways. Now that I'm pseudo-familiar with the rules I've run into the issue of whether to homebrew my character's powers or whether to build them around the Powers book. For my specific character, making a whole new magical subsystem seems most appropriate, but nowhere in the books does it permit me to do anything of the sort!

Here is the question that I am asking: is GURPS made to be homebrewed with or am I restricted to using the material provided?
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Old 09-13-2015, 03:52 PM   #2
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Default Re: When to homebrew and when to use the system?

GURPS, like any system, can be homebrewed. That said, there's a good chance you don't need to homebrew rules with GURPS because they probably exist somewhere.

That said, GURPS is a toolbox. The best way I've found to use it is to start by deciding what kind of game I'm running, and then find rules that support that. Then create the adventure and use that process to find rules I might have missed or that might not fit my initial concept. Remember that there is no default setting or stuff like that already created (generally speaking), so you will need to do your own legwork on that front. A couple of product lines (I'm looking at you, Dungeon Fantasy) provide some of this stuff for you, but are created for a specific game type.

So yes, you certainly can homebrew with GURPS. You probably don't need to (and if you find that you do, you might have good material for a Pyramid article!), but that doesn't mean all of the work is done for you. Being generic means not everything in GURPS always gets used.

[EDIT]
Addressing making your own magic system, there are several books out there that help with this sort of thing. GURPS Fantasy has information on creating a custom magic system, but GURPS Thaumatology is really the go-to for that. If you want worked examples of magic systems based on Thaumatology, look at GURPS Thaumatology - Ritual Path Magic, GURPS Thaumatology - Sorcery, and GURPS Thaumatology - Chinese Elemental Magic. All three stem from Thaumatology and are very different takes on how to create magic systems.
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Last edited by Humabout; 09-13-2015 at 03:56 PM.
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Old 09-13-2015, 03:57 PM   #3
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Default Re: When to homebrew and when to use the system?

Quote:
Originally Posted by jj234 View Post
Here is the question that I am asking: is GURPS made to be homebrewed with or am I restricted to using the material provided?
Homebrewing is more work. And it's possible to mess it up and get something that doesn't work, in many ways, of which "isn't a fun game" is the most serious. But that's the limit of its disadvantages.

There are a lot more magic systems than the one in the Basic Set. They're sold as PDFs. It's possible that one of them will fit your needs, and if you describe what you're trying to achieve, we can tell you if it matches up to any of the published systems.

There is an entire book about designing magic systems, GURPS Thaumatology, which will help a lot if you need to design your own.

Some basic questions: Are you looking for a system where you have a list of fairly fixed spells that the character can do, or one where things are improvised? What sort of timescale do you expect magic to operate on: casting in combat time, long rituals, or something in between? Can you point to a book, film or TV series that portrays something like the right style of magic?
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Old 09-13-2015, 04:00 PM   #4
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Default Re: When to homebrew and when to use the system?

For building magic systems, the system of choice is Gurps: Thaumology.

Gurps lends its self much more to houserules than homebrews. That said, most avid homebrewers would end up as fairly normal gurps players.

Feel free to ask the forum questions (including 'how do I build this magic system'). Don't feel overwhelmed by the number of books we suggest, its just a habit. You're likely to get several experts tell you exactly how to do what you want.
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Old 09-13-2015, 04:06 PM   #5
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Default Re: When to homebrew and when to use the system?

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Originally Posted by Humabout View Post
snip
But what about a case where there aren't all the rules that support your idea? I've been under the impression that GURPS was a kind of 'build your own RPG' kit. Are the pieces of this kit limited to published content or can you bring your own? The whole idea of picking and choosing the rules you like is very cleaer throughout the base books, but the notion of making your own rules isn't really discussed. Also, thanks for the fast reply!!
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Old 09-13-2015, 04:13 PM   #6
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Default Re: When to homebrew and when to use the system?

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Homebrewing is more work. And it's possible to mess it up and get something that doesn't work, in many ways, of which "isn't a fun game" is the most serious. But that's the limit of its disadvantages.

There are a lot more magic systems than the one in the Basic Set. They're sold as PDFs. It's possible that one of them will fit your needs, and if you describe what you're trying to achieve, we can tell you if it matches up to any of the published systems.

There is an entire book about designing magic systems, GURPS Thaumatology, which will help a lot if you need to design your own.

Some basic questions: Are you looking for a system where you have a list of fairly fixed spells that the character can do, or one where things are improvised? What sort of timescale do you expect magic to operate on: casting in combat time, long rituals, or something in between? Can you point to a book, film or TV series that portrays something like the right style of magic?
I'm basing my campaign on the anime Naruto. Yes, I have seen all the other threads. They typically discuss using the Powers approach, but this seems to require an eidetic memory of all the modifiers and other stuff associated with the Powers book. Even if I was more familiar with the book I still hate the idea of being limited to the modifiers printed on the pages. Having a finite number of options to choose from really doesn't sit well with me.Any insight you could provide on how to achieve a Naruto-like magic (or power) system would really help.
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Old 09-13-2015, 04:16 PM   #7
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Default Re: When to homebrew and when to use the system?

Of course you can make your own rules. Most GURPS players like to tinker. Besides, Kromm's too busy right now to come over to your house and stop you.

What did you have in mind for your magic system? How does it work; what do a couple of spells look like (in English/flavor text, mechanics can wait). Some examples or a little more detail might let people direct you to any rules that are similar.
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Old 09-13-2015, 05:07 PM   #8
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Default Re: When to homebrew and when to use the system?

The SJ Games game police aren't going to stop if you want to invent your own rules, and things like the new Dungeon Fantasy Barbarian features are literally stuff that were house-ruled in the author's home game and then playtested and published.

So there's no one from SJGames that prevents you from using your own rules, and they often publish (in Pyramid or other sources) examples of house rules.

However, your playgroup and/or your GM may have some influence over your house rules. Just because you propose something, does not mean that your GM has to accept it. And even if you're a GM, a proposed house rule may not meet approval from the rest of the gaming group. Both situations have happened to me many times over the last five years of rules tinkering.
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Old 09-13-2015, 05:17 PM   #9
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Default Re: When to homebrew and when to use the system?

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Originally Posted by jj234 View Post
But what about a case where there aren't all the rules that support your idea? I've been under the impression that GURPS was a kind of 'build your own RPG' kit. Are the pieces of this kit limited to published content or can you bring your own? The whole idea of picking and choosing the rules you like is very cleaer throughout the base books, but the notion of making your own rules isn't really discussed. Also, thanks for the fast reply!!
If there aren't rules that support my idea, I usually try to formulate some that will work and possibly post them here to get a critique. I don't think you have to worry about Kromm or PK breaking down your door if you use a rule they didn't edit. I'm not sure what would stop you from houseruling or making up your own rules, aside from any concerns about how they'd interact with existing rules.

You know, if you tell us what you're trying to do, we can probably help you with it. I can only think of one or two instances where there weren't rules yet for something I wanted to do; someone just needed to point me at where to look.
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Old 09-13-2015, 05:29 PM   #10
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Default Re: When to homebrew and when to use the system?

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Originally Posted by jj234 View Post
I'm basing my campaign on the anime Naruto. Yes, I have seen all the other threads. They typically discuss using the Powers approach, but this seems to require an eidetic memory of all the modifiers and other stuff associated with the Powers book.
No it doesn't. It just requires the group to learn the rules related to the powers they have. The GM needs to learn the rules for whatever the players have and what the NPCs he's running that session have.

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Originally Posted by jj234 View Post
Even if I was more familiar with the book I still hate the idea of being limited to the modifiers printed on the pages.
So make up your own and base their values on published examples. Just be careful, because your results are only as good as your numbers. Playtesting may prove that your creations are broken and warrant revision. Your group should be cool with retconning when stuff is messed up.

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Originally Posted by jj234 View Post
Having a finite number of options to choose from really doesn't sit well with me.
Unfortunately, Steven Jackson Games is still working on their infinite-page-count edition with no definite release date in sight. Don't tell anyone I leaked this, but one of the authors told me that every time they think they're nearing the end, they realize it's still too finite and have to add more content.

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Originally Posted by jj234 View Post
Any insight you could provide on how to achieve a Naruto-like magic (or power) system would really help.
I'd start with everything costing FP or Energy Reserve (Chakra). That's the Costs FP limitation. It probably has some kind of mundane countermeasures, but I'm not sure if there are low- and no-chakra areas or not, so I'm not sure if you can claim the accessibility limitation from that. So I'd eyeball a general power modifier at -10% to -15%, where it's basically the same as Magic (-10%) plus Costs FP (-5%). Individual power builds you'd have to describe in detail for anyone to help you build. That said, I'm pretty certain you can do it with Powers.

All of that said, feel free to make your own system up, but it'll need extensive playtesting just like any brand new system. Don't be surprised if it doesn't survive first contact with your players.
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