06-21-2021, 06:13 AM | #1 |
Join Date: May 2021
Location: Eastern Kentucky
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Transient Advantages
So I've been pondering some of the advantages...Namely
1. Patron/Allies 2. Wealth 3. Reputation 4. Status 5. Rank So when in game events transpire such that one of the above changes, do you just "charge" the players for those advantages and they pay them off before buying other stuff? In most of my games traditionally the players are wealthy by the world's standards pretty quick. Not super wealthy but wealthy. They often develop allies in the course of their adventures. I realize status is perhaps the hardest to change depending on how rigid the social structure is in a world. But even in a very strict world, if the PCs toppled a kingdom and set themselves up as the new rulers, their status would have to go up. As for Rank, I'm assuming the promotion just doesn't come through unless the PC pays and that is fairly easy to roleplay. No matter what you do sometimes you can't get a promotion. Maybe the Bishop's nephew gets to be high priest for the town and you are out of luck. On the flip side, I do think at least some roleplay might be required if the rank isn't bought right out of the gate. Again this probably doesn't come up as much mainly because the real question is why aren't the PCs going up and not why they are going up too fast. So when a PC's state changes in game, do you just add the points to buy those advantages to their "bill" and that bill has to be paid before they can improve anything else? What happens if they buy up a really high state and then suddenly the lose it for some in game reason? Do you give them back the points and can they immediately spend them elsewhere? I'm new to the game so forgive me if this has been hashed out already or is explained somewhere fully in the books. Just give me a reference. I have read the basic set through and while I feel these things get mentioned it's not as concrete clear to me as it could be. My first inclination is to allow all in game effects to take effect immediately but to "bill" the PCs and make them buy those advantages as soon as possible. When something is lost, I give them back the points but they can't spend these new points at a rate any faster than what they are getting from the session. So they can spend 10 if the session gave them 5. If they have 20 in the bank they may have to go 4 sessions to spend all the points. I realize though my first inclination is not always right so I wanted to get feedback on what you all do. |
06-21-2021, 06:29 AM | #2 |
Aluminated
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: East of the moon, west of the stars, close to buses and shopping
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Re: Transient Advantages
Generally speaking, I treat character points as one of two things:
(Oh, and having money is not the same thing as having the Wealth advantage, and I believe you'll find that the rules are explicit about this. There's a job income component which no stack of cash changes. No matter how much a character has in the bank, they do not have increased Wealth.)
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06-21-2021, 06:35 AM | #3 |
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southeast NC
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Re: Transient Advantages
Personally I like the mutable points optional rule. Character points are a character creation tool, and have no real value once play starts aside from calculating how long training takes. If you lose a limb or earn a favor, that just happens.
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RyanW - Actually one normal sized guy in three tiny trenchcoats. |
06-21-2021, 06:51 AM | #4 |
Join Date: May 2021
Location: Eastern Kentucky
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Re: Transient Advantages
So I checked out the rules again and did find a sidebar where they said advantages/disadvantages gained during play did not have to be paid for but they did count for your character point total. So that clarifies that. I just missed it.
My guess then is that if you push your rank up in an organization and then get kicked out of that organization, you don't get your points back but your point total would change to reflect you no longer have that advantage. |
06-21-2021, 07:58 AM | #5 | |||||
Join Date: Aug 2014
Location: Snoopy's basement
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Re: Transient Advantages
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If a player wants to make such a person into an ally or Patron they have to spend the points and have at least some basic in-play justification for the relationship progressing to that level. Sometimes, however, I give Allies, Patrons, Contacts and Favors as rewards instead of straight bonus points. Quote:
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I have also imposed negative Reputations when characters do things that would realistically earn that result, but it's very rare that that would apply to 'everyone' in a setting or even a 'large group'. Quote:
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Last edited by Donny Brook; 06-21-2021 at 08:01 AM. |
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06-21-2021, 08:19 AM | #6 |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sweden, Stockholm
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Re: Transient Advantages
I generally find that you have to strike a balance between letting characters earn things in play, and stopping Munchkins-behavior.
F.ex. you're not going to have happy players if f.ex.: 1) One player pays 200 points to be an escaped robot with a human brain-case. 2) Another pays 200 points to play a human with wealth+military rank+legal immunity. ...and then when the game starts he simply buys all the cool cybernetics and power armor in Ultra-Tech/Bio-Tech, effectively raising his values to the thousands before even accounting for the effective value of all the gadgets (like power armor) he buys. (Rank, etc., is there to justify the character being able to buy all this restricted stuff).
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"Prohibit the taking of omens, and do away with superstitious doubts. Then, until death itself comes, no calamity need be feared" |
06-21-2021, 09:00 AM | #7 | ||
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ronkonkoma, NY
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Re: Transient Advantages
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The rules only give options, not directives, when it comes to body modifications that can be bought. I personally feel that, generally, they should cost bonus points, and you can't lay out the cash for them until you have the points to pay for them. I don't like dealing with point debts. Realism be damned in this case. |
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06-21-2021, 09:26 AM | #8 | |
Join Date: Oct 2007
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Re: Transient Advantages
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06-21-2021, 10:04 AM | #9 |
Join Date: Jan 2014
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Re: Transient Advantages
Look, if you want a billionaire and someone with all kinds of experimental augmentations in the same party, you're best not playing with mutable point totals. I think mutable point totals work best when characters can't trivially buy everything the other players have as part of their character. Whether this means you make sure that no character is rich enough to buy tons of cybernetics or no character can't just cast possession on a really strong peasant depends on the setting.
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06-21-2021, 10:33 AM | #10 |
Join Date: Jun 2006
Location: Sweden, Stockholm
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Re: Transient Advantages
I was of course bringing up an extreme case. If you just view the points as a starting line and everything else is up for grabs for free (cybernetics etc.) then it is probably best to forbid high levels of wealth.
Anyway, by RAW the guy could still run around with Power Armor and stuff like that thanks to his rank, or whatever social advantage you use to cover the legal right to be walking around in that thing. That thing might just count as "armor", but practically it is a huge bundle of DR, scanning sense, radio, etc. as a gadget that you got significantly cheaper than if you built it as a gadget limited set of advantages. Also players can 'accidentally' break the system by creating a mega-rich guy and later deciding to buy every fancy gadget (cybernetic or not) at the fancy high-end shop. Anyway, that's what I meant with striking a balance, and what that balance is depends on the campaign's theme.
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"Prohibit the taking of omens, and do away with superstitious doubts. Then, until death itself comes, no calamity need be feared" |
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