01-12-2011, 06:02 AM | #11 |
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Birthplace of the Worst Pizza on the Planet
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Re: [Songs/rule question] Celestial Tongues and phone numbers
Since we all, for the most part, speak English, I don't see that as a meaningful distinction.
But to the compression: If 'A flat with this trill at the end' means maroon, then that is a time factor. It's also impossible, outside of that attunement, to speak on the Corporeal. One can fake it in a pigdin...with a lot of meaning lost. Look at the song as a cypher/decypher. 'Maroon' is a Note in the Symphony (one which arguably is being used in Angelic). So if I Sing 'Assassinate (the) woman wearing (the) maroon sweater' (I am excising the 'the's because their absence doesn't impact the meaning too much. It's a style, not message thing). So my words are encoded into 5 notes (assassinate woman wearing maroon sweater) and it seeks the guy it's meant for where these notes translate back into images he gets (the universal translation thing is free YMMV). (They do it this way to save Symphonic baud width) But all this is wandering in the philosophical weeds. I'm looking to have an easily understandable set of rules which don't give someone from the Lollipop Guild license to drrraaaaaggggg tttthhhheeee gggaaammmeee dddooowwwnnn as he discusses philosophically what the meaning of the word 'is' is. Not a slam, just an observation on how prone to abuse something like that might be. |
01-12-2011, 10:42 AM | #12 |
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Boston, MA
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Re: [Songs/rule question] Celestial Tongues and phone numbers
I think that the wording of the Song description implies 15 words in a vernacular language. I'm tired of my own players slowing down the game by counting words on their fingers, though, so I'm going to just tell them to keep it brief. For that reason alone, I'd count a phone number as just one or a few words.
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01-13-2011, 08:02 PM | #13 | |||
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: South of the Town across from the City by the Bay
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Re: [Songs/rule question] Celestial Tongues and phone numbers
Quote:
Celestial tongue can tell no lies. It is what it is. What better way to succinctly express that celestial is a direct transmission of knowledge w/o any representational problems or hermeneutics getting in the way. It's literally Realism as Language (which is the world view basis of In Nomine). Quote:
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We're roughly on the same page, just coming from different angles. I want to retain simplicity by focusing on a nebulous spirit, while you want to retain simplicity by focusing on finite mechanics. (Which is pretty ironic, since I find myself often leaning to finite mechanics for combat! ^_^) Sort of an endless debate, but I offer an invitation to use the other when finite mechanics bring up questions that leave unsatisfactory options, such as the post topic. :) Last edited by Azel; 01-13-2011 at 08:06 PM. |
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01-13-2011, 08:30 PM | #14 | |
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Birthplace of the Worst Pizza on the Planet
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Re: [Songs/rule question] Celestial Tongues and phone numbers
I don't have Heaven Hell available but I found this in Core
Quote:
Of course, it also says that Demons can speak the divine tongue. But then it goes on to say in the Vassal of War attunement that Demons can't understand their use of Divine Tongue |
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01-13-2011, 08:42 PM | #15 |
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: South of the Town across from the City by the Bay
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Re: [Songs/rule question] Celestial Tongues and phone numbers
That makes sense. What are lies but misrepresentation? In a language where you cannot represent anything for another (direct transmission of knowledge, Realism as Language), then there can be no misrepresentation (lies), let alone misinterpretation (confusion). As the IPG states, manipulation is an essential outer manifestation of the demonic mindset; thus how can they operate without the invention of lies and confusion?
Thus human speech, using representation and interpretation, is a natural analog to demonic speech. Thus, it's more translatable. Very reinforcing! Good find, good find. |
01-14-2011, 10:20 PM | #16 | |
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Birthplace of the Worst Pizza on the Planet
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Re: [Songs/rule question] Celestial Tongues and phone numbers
Quote:
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01-14-2011, 10:38 PM | #17 | |
Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Boston, MA
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Re: [Songs/rule question] Celestial Tongues and phone numbers
Quote:
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01-14-2011, 10:47 PM | #18 |
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: Canada
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Re: [Songs/rule question] Celestial Tongues and phone numbers
not everytime they speak it, just if they lie in it. which means a Seraph gets two notes if they lie while speaking helltongue.
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There are 10 types of people in the world, those who understand trinary, those who don't, and those who are sick to death of this darn joke. |
01-27-2011, 03:48 PM | #19 | |
Join Date: Jun 2008
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Re: [Songs/rule question] Celestial Tongues and phone numbers
Quote:
"Tamar, I made it. Please call me. [Area Code] [3-digits] [4-digits]" When I realized I was one-word over, I was like, "Do I get a discount for phone numbers? If not, I'll drop the please." Keep in mind, I don't live in Sweden and was operating under the assumption that their phone-numbers were much like our phone system in the states. Also, the "I made it" was important, because I was expressing that I'd just survived Redemption and was trying to reestablish contact. The name, "Rinnah," would probably have no meaning to Tamar, except to recognize it as being Judaic for "a pleasing song." Essentially, I was trying to squeeze in an extra word and was working with a non-existing phone number from a country I'd never visited. So, I don't think it was an entirely unreasonable request -- as was previously mentioned, there are perfectly human ways to shorten a phone numbers length in words. (i.e. "My name is Rinnah. Please, call! Area code, Eight fifty-five, twenty-eleven." -- although saying, "Area code" and then reciting a series of numbers that are not area codes could lead to some potentially confusing situations...) I was actually in favor of Inge's initial rule, more or less because I understand that the angelic tongue was hyper-compressed -- and it seemed reasonable in a pinch. I would also have been in favor of spending extra essence, so long as I didn't have to spam a Song and continuously disturb the symphony to give someone my phone number.
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"A knight's a sword with a horse. The vows, the sacred oil and the lady's favors, they're ribbons tied 'round the sword. Maybe the sword's prettier with the ribbons, but it'll kill you just as dead." |
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01-27-2011, 08:52 PM | #20 |
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Birthplace of the Worst Pizza on the Planet
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Re: [Songs/rule question] Celestial Tongues and phone numbers
Mmm...one word...I might let it slide, particularly if it didn't matter. If it was an emergency? <evil grin>
(Vision: Tamar frantically trying 9 digits of phone number and 1, 9 digits of phone number and 2...9 digits of phone number and... ;-) |
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celestial tongues, rules, rules interpretation, songs |
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