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Old 10-28-2021, 06:11 AM   #31
Shostak
 
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Default Re: Staff Countermeasures

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Originally Posted by hcobb View Post
Solid wood doesn't instantly ignite at a small spark
True. Nor can people can ignite fire—even where there is no fuel—with just their mind, a word, and a few gestures.
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Old 10-28-2021, 06:17 AM   #32
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Default Re: Staff Countermeasures

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Originally Posted by Steve Plambeck View Post
And then there's wrapping a fold or sleeve of the wizard's robe around it to smother the the staff before it's fully ignited.
Absolutely. That would cause the wizard to have to waste a turn, which is more or less what Drop Weapon does.
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Old 10-28-2021, 07:32 AM   #33
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Default Re: Staff Countermeasures

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True. Nor can people can ignite fire—even where there is no fuel—with just their mind, a word, and a few gestures.
A gesture like flick a bic?
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Old 10-28-2021, 02:08 PM   #34
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Default Re: Staff Countermeasures

I can't help but think, Henry, that you are awfully eager to defend wizards from a minor new effect. I may be wrong, but it seems to me that you're so fond of wizards as being the real power on Cidri that it disturbs you to think that an IQ 10 spell might be useful against a more powerful wizard.

There are already pretty good reasons to use a silver dagger staff (I don't allow them in my campaign however). I don't think the fact that a low level wizard might know Fire and be able to force one to drop his weapon is all that significant.

And I don't really think the controlled Fire usage is just a spark. I'll buy that it has to be applied to something flammable, but I don't think the same spell is either a minute of fire (no fuel needed, one hex size) or a mere spark.
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Old 10-28-2021, 06:23 PM   #35
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Default Re: Staff Countermeasures

For my update, let's just say standard weapons (wood or otherwise) are not flammable enough to be ignited like this. There are other things on a person that may be flammable. ITL states "He could light his own
cigar, a friend’s torch, or an enemy’s beard." Everyone has hair. If you get adjacent to a foe, you certainly can light his head of hair on fire. That is exactly within the parameters of ITL.

Other creative possibilities arise. If the foe is carrying molotails or torches on their belt, then ignite them all. If it is a fur covered animal (bears or wolves), ignite the whole creature. If you think they have something flammable in their backpack, put the fire in the backpack... maybe they had half a dozen torches in it and the whole thing will go up.

I think it makes sense to limit the controlled fire to flammable objects. That is what ITL lists.

And I think it is right to allow creative use of igniting heads or molotails, etc, as long as the wizard is willing to take the risk of getting adjacent.

I am still not convinced a weapon/staff may be lit like this.
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Old 10-28-2021, 09:20 PM   #36
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Default Re: Staff Countermeasures

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Originally Posted by Axly Suregrip View Post
For my update, let's just say standard weapons (wood or otherwise) are not flammable enough to be ignited like this. There are other things on a person that may be flammable. ITL states "He could light his own
cigar, a friend’s torch, or an enemy’s beard." Everyone has hair. If you get adjacent to a foe, you certainly can light his head of hair on fire. That is exactly within the parameters of ITL.

Other creative possibilities arise. If the foe is carrying molotails or torches on their belt, then ignite them all. If it is a fur covered animal (bears or wolves), ignite the whole creature. If you think they have something flammable in their backpack, put the fire in the backpack... maybe they had half a dozen torches in it and the whole thing will go up.

I think it makes sense to limit the controlled fire to flammable objects. That is what ITL lists.

And I think it is right to allow creative use of igniting heads or molotails, etc, as long as the wizard is willing to take the risk of getting adjacent.

I am still not convinced a weapon/staff may be lit like this.
Seems to me perfectly reasonable, Axly, to decide a wooden weapon couldn't catch fire as easily as the examples mentioned in the text, so you won't allow it.

I think I'd allow one to cast it on a staff just to reward creative thinking. Therefore, I'd also allow it for wooden weapons. Sometimes, I lean to creative solutions instead of "realism" (whatever that means in this context).
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Old 10-30-2021, 04:55 AM   #37
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Default Re: Staff Countermeasures

Another way is to hit the staff with a Quarterstaff and attempt to make the wizard drop the staff. (ITL, page 114, 2nd paragraph of quarterstaff description, successfully striking a weapon with a DX-4 attack forces the weapon holder to make a DX roll or drop the weapon). The Staff 1 spell does define the staff as an occult weapon.
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Old 10-30-2021, 06:41 AM   #38
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Default Re: Staff Countermeasures

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Another way is to hit the staff with a Quarterstaff and attempt to make the wizard drop the staff. (ITL, page 114, 2nd paragraph of quarterstaff description, successfully striking a weapon with a DX-4 attack forces the weapon holder to make a DX roll or drop the weapon). The Staff 1 spell does define the staff as an occult weapon.
If it's a Staff II+ then the drop weapon result will be ignored.
The easy way in the rules to disarm a certain uber wizard of greater Dran is to whip him to the ground then engage in HTH. This forces a drop weapon by the HTH rules at ITL 116 and he loses all of his staff abilities. He still has an insanely high ST level for a wizard under the Legacy rules, so expect him to get off a few spells anyway.
The next step is that all wizards (who worry about close combat) trade in their sticks for silver dagger staves. In which case we have to ask if a pin disarms a dagger or not?
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Old 10-30-2021, 08:09 AM   #39
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Default Re: Staff Countermeasures

"A Great Hammer to the noggin will disarm just about anybody." - possible dwarven proverb
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Old 10-30-2021, 11:21 AM   #40
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Default Re: Staff Countermeasures

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Originally Posted by hcobb View Post
If it's a Staff II+ then the drop weapon result will be ignored.
Staves II+ are immune to Drop Weapon and crit failures, but the rules do not exempt them from being whacked out of hand through disarming maneuvers.
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