09-05-2014, 01:29 AM | #41 | |
GURPS FAQ Keeper
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyïv, Ukraine
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Re: Concealed Carry (CCW), Undercover Holsters, Holdout, IWB and real-world models
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Oh, and it seems that the skill is Search, not Observation (B200, B219). * == e.g. in case of Autohypnosis, or Memetics. |
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09-05-2014, 09:14 AM | #42 | |
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Iceland*
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Re: Concealed Carry (CCW), Undercover Holsters, Holdout, IWB and real-world models
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On the other hand, a Search skill roll that takes considerable time should clearly be much more effective than Observation at spotting a concealed weapon. Search doesn't say how long an unmodified skill roll takes. A one minute pat-down of an unresisting person gives +1, however, so whatever you do to get a roll at no modifier takes appreciably less time than a minute. Based on steps 1 minute (+1) / 3 minutes (+3) / 5 minutes (+5); I think that a quick Search that is good enough not to cause a penalty ought to take somewhere between ten seconds and a half minute. Ten seconds feels more right to me, but I dunno. Other opinions? A visual scan done with Observation should probably carry at least a -2 and maybe a full -4 penalty to find hidden things that normally require a Search roll to find. It ought to be possible to spot weapons carried concealed, especially if they are just amateurishly stuck under clothing, but anyone who has the Holdout skill ought to be good at defeating an eyeball scan. Should Observation be at -2 or -4 in a Quick Contest with Search? Hmmm... I'm inclined to maybe give a -5 to the basic use of the skill to replace Search to find concealed objects with a quick one second scan, but allow Taking Extra Time. Then a ten-second scan within 2 yards, in good lighting, gives only -2 relative to using Search and a full half-minute severe eyeballing gets you the equal of what a quick ten second pat-down with Search does. Is that too beneficial to Observation skill? Too severe?
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09-05-2014, 09:54 AM | #43 | |
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Iceland*
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Re: Concealed Carry (CCW), Undercover Holsters, Holdout, IWB and real-world models
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09-05-2014, 09:58 AM | #44 |
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Iceland*
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Re: Based on reading, NOT personal experience --
There is absolutely nothing wrong with taking Equipment Bond for a given holster/gun/clothing combination, but it shouldn't necessarily cost points. It's something that costs money and time in the real world, but I think that the $300 Cost of Good-quality Ordinary Clothing designed to conceal things is fair enough.
Of course, if the rules allow, I'd usually start with a $60 item of Concealed Carry Clothing (Tactical Shooting p. 73) and add the (quality) Holdout bonus for tailoring on to the (equipment) bonus for the CCW clothing. But I don't know if that's kosher.
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09-05-2014, 10:18 AM | #45 | |
"Gimme 18 minutes . . ."
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Albuquerque, NM
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Re: Concealed Carry (CCW), Undercover Holsters, Holdout, IWB and real-world models
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Mostly because I only wear two layers of lower body clothes when it's below freezing, and that's true of most people I know. |
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09-05-2014, 10:19 AM | #46 | |||
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Iceland*
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Re: Concrete examples, Taz Walker
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If not, then you're probably using a normal Ready maneuver to draw your firearm, but maybe you have practised enough to use Fast-Draw to rack the slide as you do that, at the usual +4 to Fast-Draw for having a hand on the weapon (and another +4 to +6 TDM for doing this without stress, complications or danger). Quote:
I'm inclined to doubt that there really is no difference in difficulty between instantly drawing a weapon in Condition Zero and starting a combat turn by engaging a threat and drawing a weapon in Condition Three, readying it for use by racking the slide and then starting a combat turn by engaging a threat. Of course, it could be that this difficulty is small enough to round down to 0. Or that it is properly represented by giving a -1 to quick Contests in Who Draws First and Cascading Waits situations for someone drawing and readying a weapon in Condition Three, instead of a full-scale penalty to Fast-Draw. I don't know, because I clearly don't have Fast-Draw. If I want to hit anything, it takes me a full second to Ready the weapon at all. And that's from Condition Zero and with a hand on the weapon. Just disengaging a manual safety on an M1911 takes me from 1-3 seconds, because I'm unfamiliar with the weapon. Quote:
This suggests that Grip Mastery (Pistol) would probably be helpful in readying a Condition Three weapon as fast as possible. Maybe Fast-Draw (Pistol) is at -2 for racking the slide at the same time if you carry the weapon in a way where you'd ordinarily need your off hand to move clothing out of the way unless you have Grip Mastery (Pistol), because then you can use the off hand normally before transitioning seamlessly into a perfect two-handed shooting stance, racking the slide as you do so. Or ought Grip Mastery (Pistol) instead reduce a -2 Fast-Draw penalty to -1? With an Average Technique or Perk available to eliminate it entirely? That already gives a +2 to Fast-Draw contests, as per TS p. 11. Of course, a weapon in Condition Three wouldn't be eligible for hip-shooting, because to ready it, you would need to draw into a two-handed firing stance anyway.
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09-05-2014, 10:24 AM | #47 | ||
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Iceland*
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Re: Concealed Carry (CCW), Undercover Holsters, Holdout, IWB and real-world models
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On the other hand, I seem to recall you living somewhere in Perpetual Summer Land. New Mexico, to my knowledge, does not ever experience anything that GURPS would define as 'winter'. It makes perfect sense that fall and winter clothing there would simply be what in other climates would constitute slightly heavier versions of Summer Clothing. Quote:
Take note, everyone, we are now talking about underpants, in a perfectly serious, game-mechanical kind of way. :) I'm defining 'one layer of lower-body clothing' as 'going commando', here. :)
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09-05-2014, 10:42 AM | #48 | |
"Gimme 18 minutes . . ."
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Albuquerque, NM
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Re: Concealed Carry (CCW), Undercover Holsters, Holdout, IWB and real-world models
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That aside, if your "two layers of clothing" is just skivies, then sure, but I think people usually wear those with summer clothes too. Undershirts IME don't get worn unless a) you work in a climate controlled office, b) it's a moisture wicking one, or c) it's getting below about 50. |
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09-05-2014, 11:10 AM | #49 |
Join Date: Feb 2009
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Re: Concealed Carry (CCW), Undercover Holsters, Holdout, IWB and real-world models
Undershirts get worn IME when it is mandated by employers or when dressing up for say a job interview. Having blown way to much money on various types of supposedly 'cooling' undershirts I don't think any of them do any better than generic Walmart ones when worn under a uniform shirt and thrust vest
Despite living in NE Ohio for half my life the only times I've ever worn two layers of pants due to cold was when hunting (due to sitting outside not moving) or when actively rolling around and playing in the snow. Normally ordinary khakis are perfectly fine for normal wear in the winter as long as your not being high motionless or getting in direct contact with the snow |
09-05-2014, 12:09 PM | #50 | ||||
GURPS FAQ Keeper
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Kyïv, Ukraine
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Re: Concealed Carry (CCW), Undercover Holsters, Holdout, IWB and real-world models
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Tags |
ccw, equipment, high-tech, holdout, tactical shooting |
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