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Old 10-30-2020, 03:11 AM   #11
Sorenant
 
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Default Re: [LT] Refluffing Mail and Plate as Plate over Mail?

DanHoward, is there some reason this kind of armor didn't catch on in western Europe? Does it have to do with the needs of each region?
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Old 10-30-2020, 06:49 AM   #12
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Default Re: [LT] Refluffing Mail and Plate as Plate over Mail?

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Originally Posted by Sorenant View Post
DanHoward, is there some reason this kind of armor didn't catch on in western Europe? Does it have to do with the needs of each region?
There was no need for it. It was developed as a replacement for lamellar and lamellar was never popular in Western Europe.
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Old 10-30-2020, 07:32 AM   #13
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Default Re: [LT] Refluffing Mail and Plate as Plate over Mail?

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There was no need for it. It was developed as a replacement for lamellar and lamellar was never popular in Western Europe.
Interesting! Would I be wrong to assume it has to do with what armorsmiths were used to make? From past post of yours I believe both western mail and eastern lamellar were effective enough against spears and arrows, so the smiths of each region that had been doing one style for his entire career didn't have any need to learn about the other one, is this correct? Maybe prejudice ("lamellar is saracen armor, unfit for a good christian!") had something to do as well?
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Old 10-30-2020, 08:10 AM   #14
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Default Re: [LT] Refluffing Mail and Plate as Plate over Mail?

Fashion and tradition played a much greater role in armour production than many like to admit.
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Old 10-30-2020, 08:44 AM   #15
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Default Re: [LT] Refluffing Mail and Plate as Plate over Mail?

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Fashion and tradition played a much greater role in armour production than many like to admit.
Young whippersnappers with their fancy full plate harness. Back in my day, we wore mail. And we had to walk fifteen miles in the snow to get it. And we liked it.
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Old 10-30-2020, 09:05 AM   #16
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Default Re: [LT] Refluffing Mail and Plate as Plate over Mail?

OP, those are good vids and I really like the coat-of-plates one. Looks a bit heftier than the brigandine I've seen elsewhere on youtube.

The example you posted as to what you're looking for probably would be more aptly described by using the armor layering system. Light or medium mail, and then a plate torso piece. That -1 to DX isn't as big of a hit as it seems for a properly built warrior, they've got DX and skill to spare.

However, folks have posted a bunch of really cool images and videos of mail and plate with biggish plates, littlish plates, in-between plates... yeah you're not breaking anything. Maybe your plate is thin enough that it plus the mail beneath it equals the stat line of protection. Conversely, the mail (or fabric) of the underlayer is thin enough on the torso to not trigger the DX penalty and relies on the plate for the bulk of the protection. Or, maybe the mail doesn't actually go beneath the plate section and is attached to the edges around it.

It really sounds like you're respecting the spirit of the armor design.
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