What makes for a good pick-up game?

[thrash]

Originally Posted by Black Leviathan

The setting should be high-concept. Time you spend having to explain the intricacies of the world is time taken from the story. If you to say more than It's Blank, but with Blank, (IE It's Pirates of the Caribbean but with D&D Magic) then explaining the world and answering questions is already eating up your time.

Agreed.

On the subject of not wasting time, streamlining character generation with templates or premade characters just makes more sense.

For a con game, where you don't know who your players are going to be, I agree. I'm not as certain this is important for an established group trying out a one-shot, or for an ongoing series of pick-up games.

Note that pre-gen characters still have a learning curve for players. First, it is customary to let the players choose among the pre-gen options, which still takes time. Then the players' burden shifts from deciding what capabilities they want their character to have to figuring out what capabilities come with the character they've been handed. At least with a bespoke character they know what concept they were trying to achieve.

The best one-shot games have a packaged background concept .... The Characters ... all have a unified purpose and responsibility out of the gate, nobody has to be cajoled or explained into the story.

On the other hand, a one-shot can get by on the flimsiest of pretexts since it only has to work once. "You are the crew and owners-aboard of an interstellar freighter" is a great unifying concept -- until the pilot and the gunner can't make the session this week.

A surprising number of published Traveller adventures start from the premise that the player-characters are the only off-worlders available for some task. A setting where "adventurers" (however defined) are useful but thin on the ground offers a continuing rationale for odd-job offers. If steady, well-paying, or safe jobs are scarce -- for them, anyway -- there may be more incentive to take what comes along and make it work with whoever is at hand, or to chase after a rumored payoff with a rag-tag crew.

Convoluted plots don't work very well for a pick-up game.

I agree about "convoluted," but I'm not sure about "plots" in general. There needs to be room for the player-characters to resolve the situation you've presented them in whatever way works for them. In true short story or movie script fashion, however, the GM should be ready to dump maybe two complications or reversals on them, at roughly 1/4-1/3 and 2/3-3/4 of the way through the session (e.g., at the 1-hour and 3-hour marks of a 4-hour session).

If your players have to huddle for more than a few seconds to address where to go next, that's trouble.

Dusk City Outlaws has a mechanism that, essentially, punishes the players for spending too much time planning, rather than diving in and improvising. That one is hard for me as a player, especially in a caper-focused game, but I understand the impatience. Scum and Villainy (and probably other Forged in the Dark games), on the other hand, has a "flashback" mechanism that allows players to address flaws in their (hastily improvised) plans, at a cost proportional to how complex or unlikely the correction is.

Player hesitation may also be an indicator that the situation you presented is not as clear-cut as it seems to you, the GM. It might be time to drop another clue in their laps.

Always lay out a thick tapestry of places the characters could go to to get answers at a price.

Not sure about this one for a low-prep game. It is probably better to have the flexibility to provide what the characters need regardless of where or how they think to get it -- though not, as you say, without some cost in time or effort.

I personally believe a one-shot requires a conflict. ... I feel at some point in a pick up game everybody should be staring intently at the dice roll someone is making and genuinely worried about the consequences of bad luck.

Fair point. Spirit of the Century (which I hope to cover in more detail later) recommends setting a time-limit to create dramatic tension of this sort.

[Black Leviathan]

Originally Posted by thrash

Agreed.
For a con game, where you don't know who your players are going to be, I agree. I'm not as certain this is important for an established group trying out a one-shot, or for an ongoing series of pick-up games

.
If you know your players and they've played in the setting before, perhaps maybe. You could just say "Next session we're doing a one-shot in Dave's Fantasy Setting, Everybody make starting characters "normal" chargen, no demons", and you're golden. If you have some new players or if you're dropping a new game world, pre-gen characters or characters built on template makes getting beyond the more frustrating and time consuming aspects of character generation easier. In my book saved time is always an asset you can use well in a pick-up game.

Note that pre-gen characters still have a learning curve for players.

I didn't mean to suggest pre-gen characters remove chargen or new player orientation burden. But it does lessen those tasks. It narrows a focus that simplifies that portion of the game session.

A surprising number of published adventures start from the premise that the player-characters are the only off-worlders available for some task.

If that's the concept that unifies the characters, that's still on some level something the players can pull together around without having to go through a convoluted series of encounters where the players all meet one another. With just a small shove all of those off-worlders could have worked together before, or could all be employed by a single faction, aligning their motivation and drive.

I agree about "convoluted," but I'm not sure about "plots" in general. There needs to be room for the player-characters to resolve the situation you've presented them in whatever way works for them. In true short story or movie script fashion, however, the GM should be ready to dump maybe two complications or reversals on them

That's just not tenable for me on either side of the screen. Pick-up games attract too many players with no established dynamic with the GM. It makes it really tough to manage things that are intended to puzzle the players. That calls for greater simplicity not greater complexity. A completely flat plot is unmemorable to your players, but at a table of people who don't know how you run your games, with new characters and probably a new system, you want a plot with an objective that doesn't ever vanish from view. I can't see introducing any new plot elements past the half-way point in a pickup game. You should be entering the climax of the story by then, and a 3/4 you should be into resolving it.

Player hesitation may also be an indicator that the situation you presented is not as clear-cut as it seems to you, the GM. It might be time to drop another clue in their laps.

I find it much easier just to not make the story complicated enough that the plot has to be rescued by additional clues. At the point where the players are flummuxed throwing them a lead is only saving the game, not their enjoyment of it.

Not sure about this one for a low-prep game.

I wouldn't presume a pick-up or one-shot game is low-prep. I think I good drop-and-go plot requires much more preparation than a session of a long campaign.

[L.J.Steele]

I'm beginning to think that Magical Kitties Save the Day is an ideal pick-up game. Easy rules. Silly but clear concept.

[thrash]

Originally Posted by Black Leviathan

"... Everybody make starting characters "normal" chargen, no demons", and you're golden.

That's a one-shot, yes, but not a pick-up game by definition. While it's a viable approach on its own, it's not germaine to this thread.

A completely flat plot is unmemorable to your players, but at a table of people who don't know how you run your games, with new characters and probably a new system, you want a plot with an objective that doesn't ever vanish from view. I can't see introducing any new plot elements past the half-way point in a pickup game. You should be entering the climax of the story by then, and a 3/4 you should be into resolving it.

I think we may be talking past one another here. In a low-prep, pick-up game, I'm not likely to have a pre-determined Plot at all. At best, I have an initial situation and some idea of what will happen if the player-characters don't intervene in it (the no-action alternative, if you will). A lot of what would be "plot elements" in another type of session is left up to improvisation and responding to the players' choices.

I haven't had any problem with throwing additional challenges at a pick-up group. The first one usually comes after character selection/generation and an introductory scene to build some familiarity with the game system and the other players. This one reveals the full nature of whatever they've set out to do, including obstacles that wouldn't be apparent until they actually become engaged. After the player-characters have worked through those issues for a while, a second challenge re-focuses them and sets up the final climax and resolution.

The difference here is that I don't have any pre-conceived notion of how the player-characters are going to go about addressing the issues that I present. In that sense, there is no "plot" to be "flat" -- the introduced complications are the "plot elements."

I find it much easier just to not make the story complicated enough that the plot has to be rescued by additional clues. At the point where the players are flummuxed throwing them a lead is only saving the game, not their enjoyment of it.

You went from "hesitating" to "flummoxed" in one leap. This is about trouble-shooting, before the situation gets to that point.

I wouldn't presume a pick-up or one-shot game is low-prep. I think I good drop-and-go plot requires much more preparation than a session of a long campaign.

See the first post in this thread. While writing (or adopting) a fully conceived module for a one-shot game is always an option, that's not what I'm asking about.

[thrash]

Originally Posted by L.J.Steele

I'm beginning to think that Magical Kitties Save the Day is an ideal pick-up game. Easy rules. Silly but clear concept.

The system as described reminds me of R. Talsorian's Teenagers from Outer Space, which is my go-to game for brainless fun.

On the other hand, I feel as if comedy games are cheating a bit for this discussion: for them, absurd results can be a feature rather than a bug. Player expectations are generally lower, as well.

[thrash]

Analysis: Spirit of the Century

As I was going through my library, I noticed that this Fate-based game bills itself right on the cover as "[a] Pulp Pickup Roleplaying Game." So I wanted to look more in-depth at what the authors mean by it, and what features they thought were important. In their own words:

Originally Posted by Introduction

By a pick-up game, we mean a game that follows a specific mode of play that is well suited to running games with little planning or preparation. Each game session is a self-contained story and the players and characters may change between stories with no real problems. Characters are all affiliated with an organization known as the Century Club. This loose overarching structure provides continuity, while allowing the freedom to create nearly any sort of adventure.

Standard Fate character creation is fairly involved. It would be a good investment in an episodic ongoing campaign (as the Intro suggests), especially if it's possible to recruit a large group of potential players up front. If not, and this is a "Session Only." the offered option for Fast Character Creation (pp. 28-30) fits the bill nicely.

Fate characters are rather more involved than I prefer, with ten Aspects, fifteen Skills, and five Stunts -- that's a lot to keep track of and use effectively. Aspects, at least, are supposed to be flexible and evocatively titled. Both Skills and Aspects are mechanically simple, with consistent rules and few exceptions. Stunts, on the other hand, are rules exceptions by definition and there are a ton of them to choose from. I would be tempted to do without them entirely, or restrict the players to just one that requires active management.

The most valuable part of the book, however, is the section entitled Tips and Tricks, particularly "The Power of the Pick-up Game" (pp. 276-303). The discussion here is sometimes tied to the Fate system or the Century Club setting, but largely consists of advice applicable to any pick-up game.

[L.J.Steele]

Originally Posted by thrash

Fair point. Spirit of the Century (which I hope to cover in more detail later) recommends setting a time-limit to create dramatic tension of this sort.

Originally Posted by thrash

Fate characters are rather more involved than I prefer, with ten Aspects, fifteen Skills, and five Stunts -- that's a lot to keep track of and use effectively. Aspects, at least, are supposed to be flexible and evocatively titled. Both Skills and Aspects are mechanically simple, with consistent rules and few exceptions. Stunts, on the other hand, are rules exceptions by definition and there are a ton of them to choose from. I would be tempted to do without them entirely, or restrict the players to just one that requires active management.

I did a fair amount of SotC -- one of the best of the recent campaigns. SotC proper is a bit harder to wrap your head around than some of the later iterations of Fate, but I do like it.

Coming up with good Aspects is HARD. Coming up with 10 of them is neigh impossible. Later versions of Fate narrow this to 5 -- One High Concept, One Trouble, and Three more general ones.

SotC also has a huge list of pre-defined Stunts. Later versions simplify that with a simple mechanic for creating your own. I like the flavour of SotC stunts, but the mechanics can get in the way of pick-up game.

I love SotC character creation tho -- essentially the characters together come up with a set of back-blurbs for three pulp stories each -- one where a PC is a star, and the other two PCs are supporting characters, and two others where the PC appears as a supporting character. Three of the aspects are supposed to be related to those stories -- this gives the PCs some backstory, and helps give the GM some ideas about who these characters are.

(I also love Dresden RPG city generation, but that's another topic.)

[thrash]

Originally Posted by L.J.Steele

SotC proper is a bit harder to wrap your head around than some of the later iterations of Fate, but I do like it.

There appears to be a move afoot to update SotC to Fate Core, but I would love to see a rules-light version based on Fate Accelerated. One of the related titles (Shadows of the Century, etc.) may have what I'm looking for -- I need to do some further research.

I love SotC character creation tho ... this gives the PCs some backstory, and helps give the GM some ideas about who these characters are.

I admit to being jealous of the "aspected pick-up game" as an option SotC offers (pp. 289-296). Essentially, you pick one aspect from each of two characters in the present session, decide how they interact, and go from there. Obviously, you need to have done the lengthy and highly integrated character creation process first, so it wouldn't work for just any game system or a strictly pick-up game.

[L.J.Steele]

Originally Posted by thrash

There appears to be a move afoot to update SotC to Fate Core, but I would love to see a rules-light version based on Fate Accelerated. One of the related titles (Shadows of the Century, etc.) may have what I'm looking for -- I need to do some further research.

Check out my Ellis Affair adventure in Worlds in Shadow -- it's essentially a pulp/SotC adventure ported to Fate Core.

[petrusclavus]

Simple with pre-gen characters is the staple "pick up". My go to is Paranoia - skill or less on d20 to do a skill thing. I always have a print out of a scenario and characters on a shelf.