Inventing Languages in Settings

[Harry O'Gane]

As a student of linguistics and English language, I tend to spend a lot of time writing on subjects related to both fields, and when it comes to creating new worlds (especially fantasy ones), I invent a couple of new words.

A Dungeon Fantasy setting I have GM-ed for quite some time now has turned from a brutal H&S into a diplomacy-oriented campaign, where characters act like arbitrators between two countries in war.

Now, the two countries do not speak a common language, so a third language was necessary for them to communicate (It's a war between Dark Ones allied with Elder Spawn and an alliance consisted of Dwarves and Gnomes).

So, the players picked up a very simple "trade" language I developed. Its grammar is simple, and most of the vocabulary is a hybrid made of English, Latin and Croatian words.

There is no declination, except in singular->plural; there are no articles, I decided to simply use pronouns instead of them; verbs have three forms: past, present and infinitive: future is formed with a modal verb "vael" and infinitive, and that's pretty much the only form of expressing future, since the aim of the language is to be extremely simple. Long story short, I did not want to go into too many details with the grammar and make a vocabulary too difficult.

As sessions went by, the language grew bigger and bigger. It consists of 350 simple words now and the players have picked up more than 80% of these words. When arbitrating, I give them extra points if they actually manage to relay certain messages between the two warring sides.

Before, I simply mentioned a couple of words used in a certain race's language, but I have never actually devised an unique new language like this one. So tell me, what is your experience with inventing languages? How far did you go?

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Harry O'Gane

So, the players picked up a very simple "trade" language I developed. Its grammar is simple, and most of the vocabulary is a hybrid made of English, Latin and Croatian words.

There is no declination, except in singular->plural; there are no articles, I decided to simply use pronouns instead of them; verbs have three forms: past, present and infinitive: future is formed with a modal verb "vael" and infinitive, and that's pretty much the only form of expressing future, since the aim of the language is to be extremely simple. Long story short, I did not want to go into too many details with the grammar and make a vocabulary too difficult.

As sessions went by, the language grew bigger and bigger. It consists of 350 simple words now and the players have picked up more than 80% of these words. When arbitrating, I give them extra points if they actually manage to relay certain messages between the two warring sides.

I think that technically, "declension" refers only to change of case, not to change of number.

For the kind of thing you describe, you might have found it worthwhile looking at information on creoles. There's supposedly a standard creole grammar found in independently evolved languages around the world. For example, there are three markers of verb usage, respectively for "remembered rather than currently in effect" (past/pluperfect), "thought of rather than factual" (future/subjunctive), and "repetitive or constant": One creole apparently marks these with "bin," "go," and "stay." I bin play GURPS ten year, I go play GURPS all next year, I stay play GURPS in lot campaign. It may be a bit more stripped down than you were looking for, though.

English actually has a present/past grammar with auxiliaries marking future. You can see it especially in our several sets of paired auxiliaries: can/could, may/might, shall/should, will/would. But then English went through a period of being spoken by not very fluent Norman soldiers to Saxon farmers.

Before, I simply mentioned a couple of words used in a certain race's language, but I have never actually devised an unique new language like this one. So tell me, what is your experience with inventing languages? How far did you go?

I've never gone as far as you have; I don't think my players would hold still for actually having to learn a new vocabulary. And I'm afraid I have a strong enough interest in linguistics so that I would want the grammatical peculiarities to be relevant to the plot; for example, a language spoken by human slaves of Elder Gods in the far past having an ergative grammar. That calls for more complex invented languages than I really have time for! Or, likely, skill to create.

Bill Stoddard

[Grouchy Chris]

Originally Posted by Harry O'Gane

So, the players picked up a very simple "trade" language I developed. Its grammar is simple, and most of the vocabulary is a hybrid made of English, Latin and Croatian words.

Sounds like what you have there is a pidgin.

There is no declination, except in singular->plural; there are no articles, I decided to simply use pronouns instead of them; verbs have three forms: past, present and infinitive: future is formed with a modal verb "vael" and infinitive, and that's pretty much the only form of expressing future, since the aim of the language is to be extremely simple. Long story short, I did not want to go into too many details with the grammar and make a vocabulary too difficult.

If by "verbs have three forms" you mean that they are morphologically inflected, that would be rather unusual for a pidgin. Pidgins usually mark tense or aspect on the verb with a separate particle. Inflecting for number isn't found in pidgins either, according to what I've read.

Before, I simply mentioned a couple of words used in a certain race's language, but I have never actually devised an unique new language like this one. So tell me, what is your experience with inventing languages? How far did you go?

For my fantasy campaign, I experimented with a place-name language. I came up with a vocabulary for landscape features and descriptors so that I could compound names with meanings like "white mountain" or "south port" or whatever. I wanted to simulate the repeated appearance of common roots in real place names, like -hurst or -burgh, since I thought this would add verisimilitude. But I gave it up because the names I came up with just sounded awkward and ugly. I may return to this idea some day, but for now I just make up whole names that sound good, without any fictional etymology in mind.

[jason taylor]

I thought a bit about poetic metaphors and kennings and the like that express the values of my pseudoculture. Also naming customs and the like.

[dwightemarsh]

Once, the players had directions that were written in an anchient language that none of them understood. One of the characters had the skills to research it. I had my wife help me write what I meant to say in Tagalog so that I could use a different grammer, and then given how long they researched in the library and how well they rolled, I provided more and more descriptions of what the words were and what they meant.

That only worked because the adventure was not really about reaching the location and more about the people who were chasing them to the location. It worked great though. I don't think I would have introduced the ambiguity between "love" and "expensive" that was in the word "mahal" if I had not done that.

[Peter Knutsen]

Originally Posted by jason taylor

I thought a bit about poetic metaphors and kennings and the like that express the values of my pseudoculture. Also naming customs and the like.

I've thought about greeting customs in the Keltic culture of my Ärth setting, since it's still pagan, and I wasn't able to Google up anything pre-Christian (everything I found sounded distinctly Christian and/or referred to numbers that the average uneducated Kelt would be woefully ignorant about).


When you meet someone, except a very close friend or relative (or a slave - because a slave isn't a "someone", except in special cases), you greet that person by wishing two things upon him or her, out of five possible things to wish:

Wisdom, for druids and similar (although any wisdom-seeker would have to struggle to avoid being called a druid).

Health, which is never to be wished upon brave and manly warriors, because by that you imply you hope they will live to old age and die the straw death, instead of dying gloriously in battle.

Victory, to be wished upon a warrior at any time (not wishing victory upon a warrior means you're implyig he's not a warrior - them word be fighting words!), but it can also be wished upon someone who is about to soon face another ardorous challenge, such as a law suit, or an oral exam, either as a sincere wish or as a friendly joke.

Prosperity, wished upon farmers, traders, craftsmen and so forth. Farm work (but not owning a farm that others work for you), and even more so trading (but only some crafts) are non-noble professions, and therefore especially inappropriate for men (to a large extent the notion of a cash economy is thought unclean. The Kelts aren't misogynists, but if a Keltic man has some excess silver, he's more likely to give it to his wife, or to his sister if unmarried, than to keep it himself (and ask her for silver when he needs it, or outright ask the woman to make the necessary purchases for him), and he considers being factually aware of appropriate market prices, even for basic commodities such as food or clothing, to be a mark of impurity. It's wrong and ignoble and perhaps even unmanly to know such things! In GURPS terms if you have the Merchant skill even at default, it's a minor Secret).

Luck, the generic thing to wish if you can't think of anything else.

Use two elements (and althogh a few disagree, the order of the two doesn't matter), but omitting Wisdom when greeting someone who practices one or more of the "high" druidic arts is dangerous. Omitting Victory when greeting any kind of warrior is even worse, and wishing Health upon a warrior is worst of all.

And note that some non-warriors think of themselves as warriors, and likewise some men (and a few women) of limited intellectual capacity think of themselves as being among the wisdom-seekers. Overpraise mock greetings are possible, e.g. wishing Victory upon a pacifist or invalid, or Wisdom upon a retard, although of course rude and it can lead to law suits.


The two Keltic languages, which refer to Irish and British for simplicity, do not (in the 10th century) have words for yes and no. I would never demand that players roleplay that, nor would I claim to be able to remember it consistently as GM, but as a total amateur linguist I believe I can see certain remnants of this absence in present day English usage by Irish people (e.g. "to be sure" - the Irish might have used that phrase a lot more often, back when they couldn't say "yes").

The lack of yes/no is also a fact of Latin, one of the lingua francae of the setting, and probably also a bunch of other lnguages; I haven't looked closely into the subject.

[ak_aramis]

Originally Posted by Peter Knutsen

The lack of yes/no is also a fact of Latin, one of the lingua francae of the setting, and probably also a bunch of other lnguages; I haven't looked closely into the subject.

But latin does have numerous words that indicate an answer to a yes-no question... The language definitely has the concepts of no... and the negative-form using non... and yes with the it is so fas est or sic.

And lots of choices for "almost certainly not" (minime)

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by ak_aramis

But latin does have numerous words that indicate an answer to a yes-no question... The language definitely has the concepts of no... and the negative-form using non... and yes with the it is so fas est or sic.

And lots of choices for "almost certainly not" (minime)

That sort of yes/no equivalent is probably a recurrent path of semantic change. I've lately been seeing people online quoting a previously posted statement and saying "This." That looked really subliterate to me . . . until I reflected on the Romans saying "Sic" ["Thus"] in exactly the same type of situation.

Bill Stoddard

[Peter Knutsen]

Originally Posted by whswhs

That sort of yes/no equivalent is probably a recurrent path of semantic change. I've lately been seeing people online quoting a previously posted statement and saying "This." That looked really subliterate to me . . . until I reflected on the Romans saying "Sic" ["Thus"] in exactly the same type of situation.

I'm talking about 10th century Latin, and Gaelic (and Welsh). My sources could well be imperfect, but it is possible for 21st century Latin or Gaelic to have those words, without them having been preset in the 10th century.



As for your "This", I have seen that a few times, but I more often see "QFT", Quoted-for-Truth, perhaps especially in the forums at the EVE Online website. Another term used for the same purpose, sometimes, is "Word".

Sometimes, any such option might be used because the poster wants to express agreement with a statement, perhaps a statement that otherwise has little public support, but the poster doesn't want to write a long essay that boils down to agreement with the quited material, and so opts for brevity.

And that's really caused by a lackof most (or all?) present day forum systems, that there flat out is no way, whatsoever, of responding non-verbally to a post. There's no way to acknowledge a post, in any way, except by typing letters. Obviously I fear that if something like that were implemented, it would end up as a massive popularity contest. I always lose those. But perhaps it can be done right, so that any such "non-verbal acknowledement tally" becomes about intrinsic intelletual value, rather than about whether the poster is liked or not. I really think such a system would revolutionize forum systems. In various forums, I occasionally start a thread that gets no replies at all. Sometimes that's expected. Other times it greatly surprises me.

[whswhs]

Originally Posted by Peter Knutsen

Sometimes, any such option might be used because the poster wants to express agreement with a statement, perhaps a statement that otherwise has little public support, but the poster doesn't want to write a long essay that boils down to agreement with the quited material, and so opts for brevity.

Shrug. We have such established short forms as "I agree" or "Well put" or even simply "Yes." And no one ever uses "this" to express that meaning in spoken English, perhaps because there is no way in spoken English to "point to" specific words. It kind of bothers me to see written expressions that fail to work when spoken; I'm very strongly oriented to the phonetic aspect of language, to the point of often reading passages aloud or under my breath.

Bill Stoddard