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Old 06-21-2018, 01:30 PM   #91
GranitePenguin
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Default Re: Sooo . . .What do you want?

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Originally Posted by Misplaced Buckeye View Post
Basically a living rule book that when it's necessary to change, update and even publish clearer example of a rule it's a quick two page print out and voila, an updated manual and scenario binder.
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Originally Posted by dwalend View Post
If there can be only one layout, I'd prefer one that supports this approach.
It's a great idea, except it's functionally impossible unless there's tons of dead space to allow for edits. If it's just a reprint in binder form, a simple rules change can cascade into multiple page updates, which is a complete waste of energy and resources.
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Old 06-21-2018, 01:58 PM   #92
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Default Re: Sooo . . .What do you want?

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It's a great idea, except it's functionally impossible unless there's tons of dead space to allow for edits. If it's just a reprint in binder form, a simple rules change can cascade into multiple page updates, which is a complete waste of energy and resources.
Yeah, this form essentially requires a 'one rule per page' approach, where at most you put a couple of subrules with it that still leave room for expansion if need be. That said, what would work well is an electronic version of this. That is, take the Ogre rulebook, put the rules one per page or one minor point per page (that is, all the X.Y.Z rules, where X and Y are the same) plus all the appropriate section cross-links. Layout is handled by some minimal styling and updates can be incorporated easily. Maybe even allowing individuals to add their own custom stuff.

That said, it's probably a lot of work for minimal or no return given that the rulebook is freely downloadable, but it might be something SJG would allow as a fan app if someone got permission for it first. I'd seriously consider it, except that I know absolutely nothing about mobile programming, and while I could probably make it into a database-enabled website I'm not sure how practical that would be...
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Old 06-21-2018, 07:54 PM   #93
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Default Re: Sooo . . .What do you want?

Sorry I'm a little late to the party, but my votes go to:

1) Other nation-state units (Israel, Nippon, China, Brazil, etc.)

2) A strategic or operational-level game where combat could, if desired, be gamed out using Ogre/GEV

3) LCAC's and plastic minis for the train (although maybe make it a monorail or something similarly futuristic?)

I consider "new scenarios using existing counters and maps" to be a given.

Joe / GG
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Old 06-22-2018, 07:08 AM   #94
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Default Re: Sooo . . .What do you want?

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Originally Posted by GranitePenguin View Post
It's a great idea, except it's functionally impossible unless there's tons of dead space to allow for edits. If it's just a reprint in binder form, a simple rules change can cascade into multiple page updates, which is a complete waste of energy and resources.
I have to disagree with you David. A simple addition of a new page such as 16a would fill the bill nicely to expand the book and then leave room for examples of play which in later additions might be removed and as rule edit come along the 16a page would be assimilated into the living rules. Bringing the variants in under their own heading is an additional option. Giving Ogreist the ability to have their rules, alternate scenarios and even their house rules in one customizable place seems a worthwhile piece of the overall pie.

I also note that the only reason you objected to this concept was the rule book. What about the scenarios, record sheet and card storage, etc. This concept would organize and bring together both canon and alternative fan based.

Last edited by Misplaced Buckeye; 06-22-2018 at 07:13 AM.
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Old 06-22-2018, 07:39 AM   #95
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Default Re: Sooo . . .What do you want?

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I have to disagree with you David. A simple addition of a new page such as 16a would fill the bill nicely to expand the book and then leave room for examples of play which in later additions might be removed and as rule edit come along the 16a page would be assimilated into the living rules.
16a is exactly my point. You either end up reprinting half the rulebook, or you start injecting a jumbled mess of alternate pages with multiple copies of the same rules for errata and have to keep track of which one is the most current. The only way to avoid this (as mentioned earlier) is make each page discreet info, which means a complete rewrite of the book to support it
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I also note that the only reason you objected to this concept was the rule book. What about the scenarios, record sheet and card storage, etc. This concept would organize and bring together both canon and alternative fan based.
You have the same issue with the scenario book, but that's a good example of one-topic-per-page that's easier to do than it is for rules, but it's still a question of diminishing returns for the work needed. As for organization, that would be helpful, but you can accomplish the same thing with a Trapper Keeper
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Old 06-22-2018, 08:15 AM   #96
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Default Re: Sooo . . .What do you want?

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As for organization, that would be helpful, but you can accomplish the same thing with a Trapper Keeper
Maybe the right answer is "leave enough margin for standard 3-hole punches" and we're done.

Is there some equivalent for merging .pdf s (and making notes on them)? I've found I'm more and more likely to stay digital, but haven't taken the first step toward anything as versatile as paper.
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Old 06-22-2018, 08:37 AM   #97
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Default Re: Sooo . . .What do you want?

FWIW, I take the PDFs of the Scenario books, and run them through a conversion so each and every page is a separate TIF file. I then go in and edit out the extraneous color backgrounds and artwork images, then print them as simple text blocks, map thumbnails, and charts -- then they go in a three ring binder.

I haven't done that for the rulebook yet, as I was waiting for the newest edit of it from "Battlefields", but using that system, you can crop and save any rules you want, and re-order them any way you want, to suit yourself.

Saves someone at SJG getting paid to do it and take time away from actual forward progress on other more important parts of the game.

Last edited by Mack_JB; 06-22-2018 at 11:00 AM.
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Old 06-22-2018, 10:56 AM   #98
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Default Re: Sooo . . .What do you want?

The only way I see a "modular" Ogre rulebook working cleanly and effectively is if entire Sections are isolated / replaced, instead of individual rules or pages. The nice thing is that none of them are that long...IIRC the longest [as of the Battlebox PDF] is 3.00 / Units, at 4 1/4 pages.

But it's still one of those things that will be hard to justify, since we're talking about inserting page breaks before each section and checking how they flow around vignettes / sidebar placement, and maintaining a second master copy for 'modular' use [as adding 7 additional pages would increase the size of the printed books by 20%, and with it, cost]...I dunno if it's practical.

That said, I do like the idea of some sort of binder...like one of the professional "designated note-taker" things, and that may be enough to get me off my tuches and take advantage of the "one copy for personal use" license on PDFs. :D I can always mask with blank paper and throw it in the copier to get clean-ish breaks that way, if I want dividers per section.
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Old 06-22-2018, 11:02 AM   #99
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Default Re: Sooo . . .What do you want?

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I can always mask with blank paper and throw it in the copier to get clean-ish breaks that way, if I want dividers per section.
I do like the old-school section dividers, but text search in PDFs is hard to beat for convenience.
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Old 06-22-2018, 01:55 PM   #100
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Default Re: Sooo . . .What do you want?

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I do like the old-school section dividers, but text search in PDFs is hard to beat for convenience.
Now there we are in agreement
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