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Old 08-26-2021, 11:05 AM   #51
David Johnston2
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Default Re: [Powers / Psionics] Help with Uncontrollable

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plane View Post
I guess an interesting question is whether it operates on the basis of who a character thinks are allies vs who actually are.
Basically an Uncontrollable power has it's own opinions about that. You can consider it as another person, a childish, impulsive bad tempered person. It will act against people who are trying to kill you before others because it will die with you if you are killed but it can be provoked even if you are calm and it won't exercise the best judgement in how to fight and when to stop fighting.
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Old 08-26-2021, 03:29 PM   #52
Plane
 
Join Date: Aug 2018
Default Re: [Powers / Psionics] Help with Uncontrollable

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Originally Posted by David Johnston2 View Post
It will act against people who are trying to kill you before others because it will die with you if you are killed
I'm not sure it actually would have a sense of self-preservation though... or if it did, the intelligence to actually realize what is in the best interest of the character who owns the advantage.

Say for example you have an enemy in town: a thief who robbed you and who plans to ambush you in an alley later that night and silence you before you can point him out to the local sheriff.

You see the thief in town and get angry/scared and fail your self-control roll: and against your better judgment you breathe a jet of fire and incinerate the thief.

This removes the potential threat of getting stabbed in an alley later: but perhaps you could've handled that (you're an expert with Judo and have Danger Sense) compared to the new threat your power just created for you: dozens of people just saw you breathe fire and think you're some kind of alien/witch/demon and now the sheriff and all his men will be ordered by the mayor to execute you.

This swaps out the local thief (a danger you could've easily dispatched) with a greater danger of an entire town's garrison.

This is a bad thing in terms of your survival and thus the survival of your power, so if the power understood this and valued it's own survival, it wouldn't have attacked that thief in broad daylight (instead waiting for a time when fewer witnesses were around).

What probably makes is a disadvantage is the idea that it lacks self-preservation and can actually make decisions like this which cause greater long-terms problems (even long-term dangers) for the character with the uncontrollable advantae: even if it has the ability to help you out with more immediate dangers (like an enemy out to kill you in a given moment)

This is part of why I like the idea of designing it as some mix of ally/enemy because then you could stat out better how it would react to and predict things...
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Old 08-26-2021, 03:48 PM   #53
David Johnston2
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Default Re: [Powers / Psionics] Help with Uncontrollable

Quote:
Originally Posted by Plane View Post
I'm not sure it actually would have a sense of self-preservation though... or if it did, the intelligence to actually realize what is in the best interest of the character who owns the advantage.

Say for example you have an enemy in town: a thief who robbed you and who plans to ambush you in an alley later that night and silence you before you can point him out to the local sheriff.

You see the thief in town and get angry/scared and fail your self-control roll: and against your better judgment you breathe a jet of fire and incinerate the thief.

This removes the potential threat of getting stabbed in an alley later: but perhaps you could've handled that (you're an expert with Judo and have Danger Sense) compared to the new threat your power just created for you: dozens of people just saw you breathe fire and think you're some kind of alien/witch/demon and now the sheriff and all his men will be ordered by the mayor to execute you.

This swaps out the local thief (a danger you could've easily dispatched) with a greater danger of an entire town's garrison...
Childish, impulsive and bad tempered. It understands immediate threats not long term consequences.
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Old 08-30-2021, 09:23 AM   #54
Tinman
 
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Default Re: [Powers / Psionics] Help with Uncontrollable

Kromm's answer as posted by Bruno:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kromm
An Uncontrollable ability acts on its own, as if possessed, but can't do anything that's beyond the scope of a conscious use of that ability. If it could, well, that would give annoying players a blunt instrument with which to batter their GM into allowing them to spend earned points to buy more-potent abilities which might not be appropriate. Thus, if a limitation puts restrictions on where, when, or how often the ability can function, degrades its physical parameters (duration, range, etc.), or anything similar, then that limitation's drawbacks apply to all uses -- controlled or uncontrolled.

On the other hand, if a limitation imposes a dependency on a conscious act by the user -- e.g., conducting a magic ritual, spending FP, taking a Ready maneuver, or flying at full Move -- then this need not apply to uncontrolled uses. The player should have evidence enough to conclude, rightly or wrongly, that some evil, invisible entity is spending FP or conducting rituals to set off his ability.

I think that answers all your questions, really.

(As usual, you're free to share my answer -- complete with typos -- on forums, mailing lists, etc.)
After talking to my players about Kromm's answer, Player Abe pointed out that it says one can't do a move action when the power requires a concentrate. As Kromm says:
Quote:
An Uncontrollable ability acts on its own, as if possessed, but can't do anything that's beyond the scope of a conscious use of that ability.
And normally it would require a concentrate.

I thought Kromm's answer said just the opposite. Am I missing something?
Which is after all the point of my original question!
Thanks for all the help.

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Originally Posted by Tinman View Post
I'm GMing a new psionics campaign. I'm trying to figure out how Uncontrollable (B.116) works with a character.

If a character has the incontrollable limitation on it's power & is not in control of it at the time, are they restricted to concentrate maneuvers or can they act as they wish & the power essentially acts as a compartmentalized mind?

Example:
The character is trying to run away from 3 attackers (a full move) but the power (the GM) decides it's going to attack one of them (a concentrate).

Can the character run or is it restricted to only a step?

If one is not in control of the power, then it's not like they are concentrating to use & target the power. Right?

Also, does anyone's opinion of the above change if the power is Uncontrollable & Unconscious (B.115)?
Thanks for any help.

Last edited by Tinman; 08-30-2021 at 09:33 AM.
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Old 08-30-2021, 12:12 PM   #55
David Johnston2
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Default Re: [Powers / Psionics] Help with Uncontrollable

In the context of the whole message, it is clear that "beyond the scope of a conscious use of the ability" means "it won't go off in the day if it was bought with a limitation that says "only at night".
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Old 08-30-2021, 01:28 PM   #56
Tinman
 
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Default Re: [Powers / Psionics] Help with Uncontrollable

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Originally Posted by David Johnston2 View Post
In the context of the whole message, it is clear that "beyond the scope of a conscious use of the ability" means "it won't go off in the day if it was bought with a limitation that says "only at night".
Ok, that was my initial read too.

Over all, you are in the "the power acts as an independent entity" camp & they player can do whatever he wants in his turn. Yes?
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