Limitations on Super-Strength

[Snaps]

Quick Question,

If you buy Super-Strength with a limitations, say its a gadget, like a magic belt that grants you superhuman strength, does the limitation reduce the 40 points per level for Super-Strength, or does it just reduce the size of the +300% Enhancement?

This makes a big deference in the cost of the advantage. -50% in Gadget limitations would reduce 40 points to 20 points, but -50% from +300% would put the cost at 35 points per level.

So is Super-Strength an Enhancement or an Advantage?

[SCAR]

Enhancements and Limitations on an Ability are generally totalled before applying the result to the base Ability.

So, if Super-Strength (by which I'm assuming you mean the Super-Effort enhancement in Supers) is +300%, and Gadget is -50%, thats a total of +250% on the base ST of [10] points per level, so:

ST (Super Effort, +300%; Gagdet, -50%) [35 per Level]

[Gold & Appel Inc]

But see also Multiplicative Modifiers on 4e Powers p 102 for another approach to this that, IMHO, works much better in campaigns where you expect high Enhancements on powers (eg: most Supers campaigns).

[the_matrix_walker]

Originally Posted by Snaps

Quick Question,

If you buy Super-Strength with a limitations, say its a gadget, like a magic belt that grants you superhuman strength, does the limitation reduce the 40 points per level for Super-Strength, or does it just reduce the size of the +300% Enhancement?

Enhancements can be advantages, especially when modifying something on you usually get for free (Long arms for example)

If the GM is allowing the Optional Rule: Limited Enhancements Page B111, then it can be very cost effective to limit the Super Effort Modifier (or any high priced Enhancement) directly.

[Snaps]

Okay, so by RAW super strength is considered an enhancement, not a 40 pt advantage. So things like size modifier don't effect the cost of it all that much.

[the_matrix_walker]

Right, your SM is a modifier to basic ST, the only way I could see it applying directly to the Enhanced ST Modifier is if it were combined with Growth, then you could have a character who already had enough ST to support the growth utilize the enhancement only while they are a giant.

[Sunrunners_Fire]

Originally Posted by Snaps

Quick Question,

If you buy Super-Strength with a limitations, say its a gadget, like a magic belt that grants you superhuman strength, does the limitation reduce the 40 points per level for Super-Strength, or does it just reduce the size of the +300% Enhancement?

This makes a big deference in the cost of the advantage. -50% in Gadget limitations would reduce 40 points to 20 points, but -50% from +300% would put the cost at 35 points per level.

So is Super-Strength an Enhancement or an Advantage?

Super-ST [40/] -vs- {HP +1 [2/]; Lifting ST +1 (Super-Effort, +400%) [15/]; Striking ST +1 (Super-Effort, +400%) [25/]} [42/]

Super-ST is an advantage. It follows the guidelines given in Basic for constructing new advantages, up to and including adjusting the cost of the result to be more aesthetically pleasing. Just as Divine Favor is a new advantage. Its' based on Patron but that doesn't mean it is Patron, merely that Patron was used as a pricing benchmark during its' construction.

[Mark Skarr]

Originally Posted by Snaps

This makes a big deference in the cost of the advantage. -50% in Gadget limitations would reduce 40 points to 20 points, but -50% from +300% would put the cost at 35 points per level.

To build on what Gold & Appel Inc said, that is Multiplicative Modifiers (See Powers pg 102). And, it does work well for supers. As someone who runs a lot of supers games, I recommend it.

It allows you to get your abilities at a discounted price without crippling them, at the cost of increasing the minimum price the ability can cost.

So, for non-Multiplicative Modifiers:
Girdle of Giant Strength 12 (Super ST, +300%, Gadget, -50%) [420]

With Multiplicative Modifiers:
Girdle of Giant Strength 12 (Super ST, +300%, Gadget, -50%) [240]

[the_matrix_walker]

Originally Posted by Sunrunners_Fire

Super-ST [40/] -vs- {HP +1 [2/]; Lifting ST +1 (Super-Effort, +400%) [15/]; Striking ST +1 (Super-Effort, +400%) [25/]} [42/]

Super-ST is an advantage. It follows the guidelines given in Basic for constructing new advantages, up to and including adjusting the cost of the result to be more aesthetically pleasing. Just as Divine Favor is a new advantage. Its' based on Patron but that doesn't mean it is Patron, merely that Patron was used as a pricing benchmark during its' construction.

Except that it isn't presented in that way, or with a Point cost. It is expressed as a +300% enhancement that you can buy on some or all of your ST. It is expressed as an advantage, as any modified Attribute has to be, but it's still an enhancement. If it were an advantage, then further modifiers would affect the +300% and the cost of the ST equally. While that would be a fine house-rule, it's not RAW. Super ST with an extra 100% in Modifiers costs (STx10)+400% (assuming striking is included) not ((STx10)+300%)+100%

[Snaps]

Yeah, I think by the RAW Super-Strength is intended to be an Enhancement at +300%. I can see pros and cons of doing it that way.

On the one hand its harder to get the cost down. A -10% power modifier, or even a large size modifier isn't going to bring the price down much.

On the other hand, if you got extreme you could bring the cost of Super-Strength all the way down to just 2 points per level!