Steve Jackson Games - Site Navigation
Home General Info Follow Us Search Illuminator Store Forums What's New Other Games Ogre GURPS Munchkin Our Games: Home

Go Back   Steve Jackson Games Forums > Roleplaying > GURPS

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 07-02-2010, 07:09 PM   #1
Anaxim
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Default [RULES] Rule of 16!

I was unable to search for ANY topics with 16 in them.
I am completely dumbfounded as to why this rule was conceived.
On the exact point of an SL30 spell against a 16 resist. Why should the prior be decreased to accommodate the latter?
Isn't the point of extra high levels to actively be able to quash the enemy relentlessly?

Please help.
Anaxim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2010, 07:17 PM   #2
Desthro
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Albuquerque
Default Re: [RULES] Rule of 16!

The Rule of 16 is in place to prevent people with excessively high skill from doing exactly that. This way, there is no guarantee that the skill will work 100% of the time, which is a key point to the GURPS system, nothing is 100% guaranteed, and there is an enhancement designed to allow that (cosmic), but many find it unpalatable. Note that the Rule of 16 doesn't increase the resisted target's defense to 16, and high skill still helps with penalties, despite the limitation.
Desthro is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2010, 07:20 PM   #3
Anaxim
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Default Re: [RULES] Rule of 16!

I hear your logic, my friend does not. He claims that when tied at 16+ skill, given there is 16+ on the defender, the odds to get anything done are poor.
Anaxim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2010, 07:23 PM   #4
Bruno
 
Bruno's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Canada
Default Re: [RULES] Rule of 16!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaxim View Post
I hear your logic, my friend does not. He claims that when tied at 16+ skill, given there is 16+ on the defender, the odds to get anything done are poor.
50/50. That's not great, but "poor" is pushing it.
__________________
All about Size Modifier; Unified Hit Location Table
A Wiki for my F2F Group
A neglected GURPS blog
Bruno is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2010, 07:27 PM   #5
Anaxim
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Default Re: [RULES] Rule of 16!

Friend states:
Not 50/50. Since a smaller margin on your side, as well as tie, result in failure.
Additionally, if we understood right - if both fail, only the caster suffers.
Friend writes:
Furthermore, there's a difference between giving the resisting character a fighting chance and reducing a more potent attacker to a position of weakness.
Anaxim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2010, 07:29 PM   #6
Pagan
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Default Re: [RULES] Rule of 16!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaxim View Post
I hear your logic, my friend does not. He claims that when tied at 16+ skill, given there is 16+ on the defender, the odds to get anything done are poor.
Have your friend run a gurps campaign for a few months where skill 30 mages are blasting Attribute 16 characters without the rule of 16. I'd like to know his opinion on how much fun that would be.

LOL, plus, remember, the rule of 16 works for you also.
__________________
"First Scarran you see, you tell him who his daddy is....tell him Dargo!"
Pagan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2010, 07:36 PM   #7
Anaxim
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Default Re: [RULES] Rule of 16!

Pagan, you make fine points.
I've appeased the friend by using the text for regular contests with scores over 14 and applying it to contests. Not sure if those should apply to quick, though.
Anaxim is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2010, 07:55 PM   #8
jeff_wilson
Computer Scientist
 
jeff_wilson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Dallas, Texas
Default Re: [RULES] Rule of 16!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaxim View Post
I hear your logic, my friend does not. He claims that when tied at 16+ skill, given there is 16+ on the defender, the odds to get anything done are poor.
The answer is to use means other than resisted spells against enemies with high resistance. Create Fire and Zombie are good places to start.
__________________
.
Reposed playtest leader.

The Campaigns of William Stoddard
jeff_wilson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2010, 09:42 PM   #9
cmdicely
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Default Re: [RULES] Rule of 16!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Anaxim View Post
I was unable to search for ANY topics with 16 in them.
I am completely dumbfounded as to why this rule was conceived.
On the exact point of an SL30 spell against a 16 resist. Why should the prior be decreased to accommodate the latter?
Isn't the point of extra high levels to actively be able to quash the enemy relentlessly?

Please help.

IMO, the Rule of 16 is somewhat overkill; it serves a real purpose, but as it is it somewhat overbalances things in favor of resistance.

It might make sense to have a a magical analog of Deceptive Attack that provides a -1 to the target's resistance in favor of a -2 to effective spell skill. This would particularly make sense if using the Alternate Magic Ritual rules and other rules that provide reasons for spellcasters to trade spell skill for other effects (if reducing resistance is the only thing to trade off skill for, there's little reason not to trade off all skill over 16 for it every casting.)
cmdicely is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-02-2010, 10:09 PM   #10
Edges
 
Edges's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: GMT-5
Default Re: [RULES] Rule of 16!

Not everyone is in favor of the Rule of 16.

Some ways to get around it:
There's the Rule of 17 perk in Power-Ups: 2. (And I've hear of house rules pushing it higher.)
On an advantage, you can take the +50% enhancement, No Rule of 16.
For an advantage you can get Based on (Different Attribute), to target weaker defenses.
You can just get rid of it in a campaign and see how it plays.


From the guru.
Edges is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
rule of 16

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Fnords are Off
[IMG] code is Off
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -6. The time now is 07:32 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.9
Copyright ©2000 - 2023, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.