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Old 07-30-2021, 09:39 AM   #51
bocephus
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Default Re: Limiting skill points

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Originally Posted by MaryAnn View Post
I have done what I could. It still looks like an improvement on Iron Man, but at least she can't keep expanding the repertoire of skills without giving up the old ones.

This is the provisional result for the character

Aleksandra "Sasha" Nikolayevna Romanova, a.k.a. "The Mechanic"
Ok, wow... um whats the point? Is this supposed to be The big bad? I dont understand what this character is... I mean I see what your going for "Tony Stark" mechanical genius extraordinaire... and then some whipped cream on top. But other that a big list of skills at an insane level, what is the purpose of this character?

Maybe better I ask why you would model Tony Stark as a list of skills and not just a few wildcard skills and some luck and serendipity advantages. He's a genius that just gets it... not a guy with 47 advanced PHD's

My last and probably most relevant question, what do other PCs/NPCs look like in this world? I cant help thinking this is a horrible way to spend 2000+ points to model what your trying to do. Admittedly this isn't my genre, but this isn't how I would have done it.


Edit so I browsed through the advantages list and I would probably go with something along these lines (Using the Marvel movies Robert Downy Jr version as the template, cause there are at least 6 comic book version I am aware of)

I couldnt see if you paid for it, or if it would be appropriate to the character but
Multimillionaire 2 would apply to Tony Stark (10,000 times starting cash)
Independent Income ~10 probably would also apply (if you're going to run this for more than a one shot, otherwise ignore this)

Advantages
Charisma at least 3 levels
Indominable and/or Unfazeable
Fearlessness 2 or 3 levels
Photographic Memory (really I think Eidetic memory is probably more accurate to the character, but mechanically I could see either used)
Less sleep 2-3 levels (He seems to be almost permanently manic)
Daredevil - this is more about his combat than building stuff but fits, and he does some pretty risky engineering where this *could* apply
Quick Gadgeteer (maybe just Gadgeteer depending on how the game is modeled)
Intuitive Mathematician
Extraordinary Luck and/or Serendipity 2
Rapier Wit
Signature Gear built as ally (expensive) easily pushing 200-300 points on Iron mans suit maybe more depending on details (like I said not my genre). No ideal what Jarvis would cost but he's a modifier to engineering skill IMO so required for the character
Single-Minded

Talents (heres where things can get weird depending on how you break it down but for sure max 4 levels in every talent pool regardless of how you break it down)
Computer stuff - specifically an AI that gives a bonus to engineering
Vehicle stuff -
Math/physics stuff -
Weapon stuff -
--------------------- there could be a couple of points of intersection and overlap here which is sort of what you want and legit for how he applies his skills IMO. At some point you will find overlap, like your computer AI. There will be skills that give bonuses to Engineering/Invention. With 2000 points to play with it really isnt about your point cap.-----------

*************************************
Now your skills are MUCH cheaper and modeled a little better.
Engineer (all) would start normally at IQ-2 but depending on how you model talents could be as high as IQ+6 with 1 point.
I wasn't paying attention to what you set the IQ at but at 14, one talent +4 gives you a skill 16 IQ+2 in all engineering with one point. Then you add any modifiers like Jarvis and other skills that might give a bonus... You should be running somewhere in the 18-20 range on any engineer roll with just one point.

This is still going to be a 1000+ character but a far cry from the 2100 your already working with, and more in line with what people usually post about Supers.

Plus this character now has Luck which is HUGE. As well as Multimillionaire, the Suit and Jarvis as signature gear.

Last edited by bocephus; 07-30-2021 at 11:00 AM.
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Old 07-31-2021, 12:50 AM   #52
corwyn
 
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Default Re: Limiting skill points

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Originally Posted by Emerikol View Post
2000 points? How long has she been playing? May campaigns would tend to max out at 1200 pts and that would take a long time to get like 5 years.
Depends where you start. World of Darkness, Lensmen, Supers games can all start far higher than 2000 pts.
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Old 07-31-2021, 02:07 AM   #53
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Default Re: Limiting skill points

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Originally Posted by bocephus View Post
Ok, wow... um whats the point? Is this supposed to be The big bad? I dont understand what this character is... I mean I see what your going for "Tony Stark" mechanical genius extraordinaire... and then some whipped cream on top. But other that a big list of skills at an insane level, what is the purpose of this character?

Maybe better I ask why you would model Tony Stark as a list of skills and not just a few wildcard skills and some luck and serendipity advantages. He's a genius that just gets it... not a guy with 47 advanced PHD's
Not everyone uses wildcard skills.
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Old 07-31-2021, 02:20 AM   #54
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Default Re: Limiting skill points

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Originally Posted by Rupert View Post
Not everyone uses wildcard skills.
Any genre supporting Stark as a plausible character probably should, if only to keep the gm sane.
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Old 07-31-2021, 02:43 AM   #55
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Default Re: Limiting skill points

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Originally Posted by corwyn View Post
Any genre supporting Stark as a plausible character probably should, if only to keep the gm sane.
Personally, as GM, I find managing wildcard skills more annoying than just having big lists of skills on a sheet.
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Old 07-31-2021, 02:47 AM   #56
Pursuivant
 
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Default Re: Limiting skill points

Assuming that you're designing machine-like characters with limited data storage and digital methods of encoding that information, your original algorithms look pretty good.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MaryAnn View Post
There is an expression that reasons it quite well: "Time erases everything".
There's also some evidence that merely accessing a memory potentially alters it.

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Originally Posted by MaryAnn View Post
There are also scientific studies that indicate that the brain can store up to 100 terabytes of memory.
Estimates range from 10-100 TB, but that begs additional questions. How does the brain encode information? How much data does the brain have to store?

If the brain can encode information more efficiently than current digital methods it might capable of holding effectively unlimited data. If it can "procedurally generate" methods of performing specific actions, "offload" data to other body parts (e.g., via literal "muscle memories" somehow encoded into neurons which control various body parts), or save space by having common tasks all share the same basic "coding" then it might work very differently from a digital or even quantum computer.

In game terms, the ability to exceed the usual limits on memory storage could be treated as a Perk or as an extended version of Accelerated Learning or Eidetic Memory.

There's also some evidence that sleep and dreaming helps us consolidate or even "prune" memories. This could represent "recoding" information from short- or medium- term memory into more efficient long-term storage or "upgrading" of existing memories by integrating new memories. It could also represent "emptying the trash" by deleting old or duplicate memories.

That means that traits which interfere with sleep, such as Insomnia or Nightmares might interfere with maximum skill levels.

Likewise, other disadvantages which indicate less than perfect brain functioning, such as Absent-Minded, Amnesia, Chronic Depression, Compulsive Behavior, Confused, Flashbacks, or Obsession might also limit maximum skill storage. These might represent memories which "take up too much space" or which "block" other memories.
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Old 07-31-2021, 03:06 AM   #57
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Default Re: Limiting skill points

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Originally Posted by MaryAnn View Post
1. Use Will as a control attribute.
2. Use the advantages of Eidetic Memory and Photographic Memory as possible substitutes (Eidetic Memory = Will-(15) and Photographic Memory = Will-(20), for learning purposes).
3. Reference the value to the speed / range table from Basic Set.
Interesting, but I think that you underestimate the effects of Talent, which can represent not just "hard coding" which makes one more adept, but also innate interest and passion for a particular subject which effectively enhances Will.

Talent might act as a "Potential Skill Set" allowing a character to "instantly" learn up to Talent Level^3 points in skills upon exposure to a learning proper environment and given minimal encouragement. This allows for child prodigies who quickly demonstrate master-level performance at a very young age or for "ace in a day" type military characters who demonstrate an uncanny knack for combat despite limited training.

While such characters still need to pay character points for learned skills, Talent allows them to acquire them more quickly.

On the other side, you also ignore various mental disadvantages which limit memory formation or block, distort, or destroy existing memories. For example, a trait like Absent-Minded or Short Attention Span might represent short-term/long-term memory storage or retention problems, potentially massively limiting maximum memory size or learning speed.
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Old 07-31-2021, 05:01 PM   #58
Tuk the Weekah
 
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Default Re: Limiting skill points

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Originally Posted by whswhs View Post
You could represent it that way. But it might be simply a familiarity, given how many women walk around in high heels.

Or it might be a perk, given that High-Heeled Heroine, which lets you make combat rolls in high heels, is no more than a perk!
For what it's worth, in my 1600s-1700s era campaigns, I had High-Heeled Hero as a perk, as high heels were a symbol of class stratification amongst men. If you couldn't fight a duel in heels, you were no gentleman.
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Old 08-02-2021, 12:48 AM   #59
corwyn
 
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Default Re: Limiting skill points

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Originally Posted by Tuk the Weekah View Post
For what it's worth, in my 1600s-1700s era campaigns, I had High-Heeled Hero as a perk, as high heels were a symbol of class stratification amongst men. If you couldn't fight a duel in heels, you were no gentleman.
I very vaguely remember that. However, I was probably playing a "demonic" gnome at the time. Did anyone take it?
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Old 08-02-2021, 05:13 PM   #60
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Default Re: Limiting skill points

I'm curious if the OP took into account the optional 'Maintaining Skills' rule from the Basic Set, p. 294. If a character is spending all of their time improving a skill with intensive training, they will eventually be rolling to see if they lose other skills.
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