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Old 08-14-2023, 09:39 AM   #1
Bathawk
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Default The Wildey .45 automatic pistol

Hey, probably short and sweet.

Since I have no life, I spend time converting characters from other systems over to Gurps. One Character had a "Wildey .45 pistol" I at first thought this was a fictional weapon and was going to treat it as "super equipment", but a quick google search shows this gun does exist.

I don't have access (right now) to High Tech, should I just use the "generic" "TL:6 Auto Pistol .45" from the basic book, or would there have to be additional modifications to the stats to "create" the Wildey?
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Old 08-14-2023, 10:15 AM   #2
Varyon
 
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Default Re: The Wildey .45 automatic pistol

Looking it up, the Wildey in .45 appears to use magnum cartridges, rather than the .45 assumed of the auto pistol (which is meant to cover weapons like the M1911). I'd say the stats of the .44 magnum in Characters might be more appropriate, but looking at the energy delivered by the .45 Wildey, it matches more closely with a +P+ version of the .44 Magnum. I'd probably set damage to at least 3d+2 pi (possibly higher, it has twice the energy - typically around 1.4x damage - of the .44M, which deals 3d pi), Range to maybe 250/3,000, weight to 4 lb (possibly heavier if it's longer than the typical 5" barrel), maybe 0.5 lb for a magazine, shots to 7+1(3), and ST to 11 or 12. The rest would match the stats of the .44M Revolver in Characters. Price would be up to you; I'd be inclined to go with $1200 as a somewhat-appropriate price boost for its performance relative to the reference revolver (although more like $1500 to $2000 if setting damage to the 4d+1 pi implied by the high muzzle energy).
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Old 08-14-2023, 10:17 AM   #3
Fred Brackin
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Default Re: The Wildey .45 automatic pistol

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bathawk View Post
I don't have access (right now) to High Tech, should I just use the "generic" "TL:6 Auto Pistol .45" from the basic book, or would there have to be additional modifications to the stats to "create" the Wildey?
Oh no. The Wildey is rather more powerful than the .45 ACP that is the basis for the generic pistol in Basic.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.475_Wildey_Magnum

There's a chart here for the various Wildey calibers and iit shows the .45 shooting a 230 gr bullet at 1730 fps. That is the right bullet weight for a.45 ACP but easily 2x the velocity.

When altering rounds in Gurps damage increases in a linear fashion with velocity. So you're looking at c. 4D P+.

Take the weight from internet search and use at least the range of the .44 Magnum from basic. Recoil and MinST would also be at least that of the .44.

So it's more than just cool-looking.
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Old 08-14-2023, 11:25 AM   #4
mlangsdorf
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Austin, TX
Default Re: The Wildey .45 automatic pistol

Quote:
Originally Posted by Varyon View Post
Looking it up, the Wildey in .45 appears to use magnum cartridges, rather than the .45 assumed of the auto pistol (which is meant to cover weapons like the M1911). I'd say the stats of the .44 magnum in Characters might be more appropriate, but looking at the energy delivered by the .45 Wildey, it matches more closely with a +P+ version of the .44 Magnum. I'd probably set damage to at least 3d+2 pi (possibly higher, it has twice the energy - typically around 1.4x damage - of the .44M, which deals 3d pi)
The Magnum Arms BFR "pistol" firing .45-70 rifle rounds canonically does 4d+2 pi+ (Monster Hunter Loadouts p 10) or 5d-1 pi+ when configured for .454 Casull. 5d-1 pi+ for a Wildey seems about right, though that could drop off a lot if fired from a short barreled pistol.
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Old 08-14-2023, 12:46 PM   #5
Varyon
 
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Default Re: The Wildey .45 automatic pistol

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Originally Posted by mlangsdorf View Post
The Magnum Arms BFR "pistol" firing .45-70 rifle rounds canonically does 4d+2 pi+ (Monster Hunter Loadouts p 10) or 5d-1 pi+ when configured for .454 Casull. 5d-1 pi+ for a Wildey seems about right, though that could drop off a lot if fired from a short barreled pistol.
Looking up the .454 Casull cartridge (which never fails to make me think of Alucard from Helsing), it looks like it's consistently around a quarter again the muzzle energy of the .45 Wildey Magnum (~2,500 J as opposed to ~2,000 J), meaning the Wildey should deal somewhere around 89.4% as much damage, or an average of 14.75 per hit - I'd be comfortable calling that 4d+1 (which is also the same as I got based on the .44 Remington Magnum having ~half the energy of the Wildey and dealing 3d, which was 14.847 average damage). So I'd be comfortable with 4d+1 pi+ (I previously misidentified this as pi) - I assumed I was doing something wrong initially, as I didn't expect a handgun round to do that much damage (hence low-balling it at 3d+2), but I'd forgotten about the ridiculousness of the Casull.
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Old 08-14-2023, 01:02 PM   #6
Bathawk
 
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Default Re: The Wildey .45 automatic pistol

Quote:
Originally Posted by Varyon View Post
Looking up the .454 Casull cartridge (which never fails to make me think of Alucard from Helsing), it looks like it's consistently around a quarter again the muzzle energy of the .45 Wildey Magnum (~2,500 J as opposed to ~2,000 J), meaning the Wildey should deal somewhere around 89.4% as much damage, or an average of 14.75 per hit - I'd be comfortable calling that 4d+1 (which is also the same as I got based on the .44 Remington Magnum having ~half the energy of the Wildey and dealing 3d, which was 14.847 average damage). So I'd be comfortable with 4d+1 pi+ (I previously misidentified this as pi) - I assumed I was doing something wrong initially, as I didn't expect a handgun round to do that much damage (hence low-balling it at 3d+2), but I'd forgotten about the ridiculousness of the Casull.
I'm a bit stunned as well...I thought most pistols would top off at the Desert Eagle's 4d...and that's with only a 6 round magazine I think
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Old 08-14-2023, 01:07 PM   #7
Fred Brackin
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Default Re: The Wildey .45 automatic pistol

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/.45_ACP

The stats given for the .45 ACP in Gurps books are for the standard military load of a 230 grain FMJ at 835 fps.

In the link I gave previously the Wildey was throwing a 230 grain FMJ at 1730 fps.

This is a simple and direct comparison. The Wildey shoots the same bullet at 2x the velocity. That will give it 2x the damage and you don't have to flail around with however much it is or isn't like a .454 Casull.
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Old 08-14-2023, 01:14 PM   #8
Ulzgoroth
 
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Default Re: The Wildey .45 automatic pistol

Quote:
Originally Posted by Bathawk View Post
I'm a bit stunned as well...I thought most pistols would top off at the Desert Eagle's 4d...and that's with only a 6 round magazine I think
Pretty sure there is a technically-a-pistol that fires .50 BMG, if you want to be silly about it.
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Old 08-14-2023, 03:03 PM   #9
Rupert
 
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Default Re: The Wildey .45 automatic pistol

Note that the performance figures for the Wildey are with a 10-inch barrel, which is unlikely to be what someone's carry or combat pistol has. Also, as with most proprietary and small-production run cartridges, the 'basic' loads are probably best considered to be Extra-Powerful in GURPS terms - they're loaded hot enough that it's very hard to handload them with enough extra power to make a difference.
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Old 08-14-2023, 03:27 PM   #10
Polydamas
 
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Default Re: The Wildey .45 automatic pistol

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Originally Posted by Rupert View Post
Note that the performance figures for the Wildey are with a 10-inch barrel, which is unlikely to be what someone's carry or combat pistol has. Also, as with most proprietary and small-production run cartridges, the 'basic' loads are probably best considered to be Extra-Powerful in GURPS terms - they're loaded hot enough that it's very hard to handload them with enough extra power to make a difference.
A lot of fiction, especially visual media, follows the rule of cool. But I agree that the full-sized Wildey would have high Bulk as well as Min St, Rcl, and damage.

Is the current formula for calculating firearms damage in GURPS published anywhere?
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