Exotic Governmental/Legal Systems

[TGLS]

Originally Posted by Johnny1A.2

But also imagine that there is a mechanism by which a general election can be triggered at random. That is, at any given time along the course of a parliament, an election can suddenly be triggered and with little warning regardless of the wishes of either the majority party or the minority parties.

I think the main outcome of all of this would be an increase in elections that nobody wants, that change little in the make-up of parliament, and are perceived as wasteful.

[johndallman]

Originally Posted by TGLS

I think the main outcome of all of this would be an increase in elections that nobody wants, that change little in the make-up of parliament, and are perceived as wasteful.

Sure would. They might occasionally be welcome, but mostly they'd make it even harder for a government to get anything done.

[Johnny1A.2]

Originally Posted by johndallman

Sure would. They might occasionally be welcome, but mostly they'd make it even harder for a government to get anything done.

Yeah, but constitutions don't always make sense. I could imagine a state trying this, wisely or not. Or at least, I can think of arguments someone might make for it, whether they actually make sense or not.

[TGLS]

Originally Posted by Johnny1A.2

Yeah, but constitutions don't always make sense.

Sure, but most Westminster-style parliaments don't put, "When do we have an election?" into the constitution, because it's deliberately variable. If the government can't agree on money, election! I can imagine a country doing this in a moment that's difficult to explain, randomly having a string of ineffectual elections, and then repealing it.

[Anaraxes]

Originally Posted by Johnny1A.2

imagine that there is a mechanism by which a general election can be triggered at random

A related notion: representatives selected at random in each election, with a mandatory civil service requirement to serve out a term if elected.

[Varyon]

Originally Posted by Anaraxes

A related notion: representatives selected at random in each election, with a mandatory civil service requirement to serve out a term if elected.

The titular colony of the webcomic Endtown was run this way for a while, albeit with the representatives being anonymous. Naturally, it fell apart when a group managed to somehow take control of it and publicly abused their power, resulting in Endtown ultimately dissolving the council and electing a leader (which wound up being the mastermind behind the takeover, whoops).

I think there were some Greek city-states that did something similar (absent the anonymity), but I may be misremembering (or got that from an unreliable source).


Faux EDIT: Oh, wait, do you mean it's more like the candidates are randomly selected, and then the people vote for who amongst them should serve a term? That could certainly be interesting... although I'd imagine you'd wind up with kingmakers (senatormakers?) corrupting the process, finding the candidates they can most readily control and using their ample resources to support their campaigns.

[jason taylor]

Originally Posted by Anaraxes

A related notion: representatives selected at random in each election, with a mandatory civil service requirement to serve out a term if elected.

That was how Venetian Doges were picked. They had an elaborate series of electors and electors of electors each filtered randomly. Then the finally got to the Doge who was often unwilling (it was a ceremonial position and required the holder to constantly play dress up whether or not he wished).

[Anaraxes]

Originally Posted by Varyon

do you mean it's more like the candidates are randomly selected

I had originally thought the person that serves as the representative, chosen from the general population. Kind of like jury duty in the US. So, always statistically representative of that population. Also extremely unlikely to result in repeated terms, so no need for term limits, and avoids an entrenched incumbency. Also avoids the costs of campaigning, so officials don't have to take time off their job to get their job again. Certainly vulnerable if someone can control the RNG.

Randomly selecting candidates is indeed an interesting variation. It largely preserves the features above, though the representation can get skewed if the voting population is themselves biased. (Compare the way prosecution and defense lawyers attempt to skew the jury in their favor by de-selecting jurors in the pool.)

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Anaraxes

Randomly selecting candidates is indeed an interesting variation.

The problem is that you're going to get a lot of people who, for whatever reason, don't want the job and/or aren't willing to go to the effort of doing the job well. In practice what you probably wind up with is the power accumulating in bureaucrats and/or lobbyists, as those will have people who both are interested and can stay in position long enough to develop expertise.

[Anaraxes]

Originally Posted by Anthony

you're going to get a lot of people who, for whatever reason, don't want the job and/or aren't willing to go to the effort of doing the job well.

In contrast to the people who want the job, yet aren't willing (or able) to go to the effort of doing the job well. As well as all the other combinations, including Cincinnatus.

The thread's not about proposing putatively ideal systems for government, merely alternative ones.