Quick-Shot/Rapid Strike/combinations questions

[Exxar]

I have two questions on this topic:

1) It is stated in the writeup that Quick-Shot (High-Tech p. 252) cannot exceed the prerequisite skill (and compensate more than a -6 penalty for Rapid Strike). But considering the possibility of performing more than 2 attacks with Rapid Strike with increasing penalties, would you consider it appropriate to improve the technique even further so that it can for example entirely negate a -12 penalty from performing 3 attacks via Rapid Strike? Or is the improvement specifically capped at 6 for some reason?

2) Since shootists have a technique that lessens their Rapid Strike penalty no matter what attacks they perform with it, would you consider it appropriate that melee weapon users also get such a technique? They already have combinations , but those are specifically limited to a predetermined combination of attacks. I know that works as a realistic option, but I was wondering if a cinematic option akin to Quick-Shot would be appropriate.

I'm interested in your various opinions on this.

[Phoenix_Dragon]

Nah. The Quick-Shoot penalty and Rapid-Strike penalty are two completely seperate things. A technique to reduce the penalty for one never affects the other. More specifically, the "cap" to techniques is a cap prior to any other modifiers. It would be no more fair to let the technique excede the cap for countering Rapid Strike penalties than it would be to offset darkness penalties.

If you want to reduce the penalty for Rapid Strike, that's a seperate technique (Combinations). You can always get both.

As for melee, no, I don't think you should have the equivelant of Quick Shooting. Quick Shooting is still a single attack with higher RoF, and therefor, less control. There isn't a melee equivelant that would be distinct from Rapid Strike or Combinations. If you're going cinematic and want multiple attacks like that, get Extra Attacks or use the optional rules allowing more attacks. TBaM/WM and Combinations make for some nasty rapid-fire melee attacks.

[Exxar]

Originally Posted by Phoenix_Dragon

Nah. The Quick-Shoot penalty and Rapid-Strike penalty are two completely seperate things. A technique to reduce the penalty for one never affects the other. More specifically, the "cap" to techniques is a cap prior to any other modifiers. It would be no more fair to let the technique excede the cap for countering Rapid Strike penalties than it would be to offset darkness penalties.

If you want to reduce the penalty for Rapid Strike, that's a seperate technique (Combinations). You can always get both.

I was not talking about Quick-Shot alleviating the penalty for (melee) Rapid Strike. My point was that Ranged Rapid Strike has a technique that negates its penalties no matter the specific attacks you perform with it, while melee Rapid Strike doesn't (it only has combinations which negate penalties of a specific sequence of attacks). I'm asking why is that so, and for opinions on whether it would be appropriate, balanced and/or reasonable to use a cinematic technique functionally identical to Quick-Shot for melee attacks.

Originally Posted by Phoenix_Dragon

As for melee, no, I don't think you should have the equivelant of Quick Shooting. Quick Shooting is still a single attack with higher RoF, and therefor, less control. There isn't a melee equivelant that would be distinct from Rapid Strike or Combinations. If you're going cinematic and want multiple attacks like that, get Extra Attacks or use the optional rules allowing more attacks. TBaM/WM and Combinations make for some nasty rapid-fire melee attacks.

I think we're on completely different tracks here. I'm not trying to emulate RoF with melee attacks.

[Agramer]

If youre referring to Bows and quick shooting than maybe not.It would look weird to shoot 3 arrows from Bow simultaneously,2 seem fine enough.

Also I think that melee rapid strike is more realistic than Bow dual weapon attack.

Guinness record of full contact punches / minute turns out to 5,7 punches/second,imagining same for shooting arrows is even beyond Legolas ;)

[Exxar]

I'm referring to all of them - melee Rapid Strikes, Ranged Rapid Strikes with thrown and missile weapons, as well as Rapid Strikes with firearms :)

In RAW it is firmly established for all of them as a combat option that you can make as many of them as you have skill (due to a cumulative -6 or -3 penalty), but the way the techniques that offset those penalties are written leaves a lot of holes.

[The Benj]

Originally Posted by Exxar

In RAW it is firmly established for all of them as a combat option that you can make as many of them as you have skill (due to a cumulative -6 or -3 penalty), but the way the techniques that offset those penalties are written leaves a lot of holes.

Not so. RAW, you can Rapid Strike only once (turning one attack into two), but Martial Arts gives the option of building a Combination for Weapon Masters or those Trained By a Master that includes turning one attack into three for -6, four for -9, etc.
It is NOT a general option.