06-02-2021, 08:15 AM | #31 |
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Re: Skill Advancement
4e, in particular, took steps away from the "nature/nurture" divide. Gone are attributes that double in cost after character creation, for example. The design really is more ergonomic this way.
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06-02-2021, 08:28 AM | #32 |
Join Date: Jun 2013
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Re: Skill Advancement
The point-efficiency of high stats (as opposed to having several high skills) is something I've struggled with as well (although I should note pretty much all my "experience" with GURPS is theoretical, tweaking the system). Sometimes, you want a character who is really good at a variety of DX-based skills due to extensive training rather than being a DX-monkey, but the DX-monkey is more point-efficient. My solution is an Advantage I call Training, which must be specialized by DX or IQ (but you can buy both separately), and costs [15] per level. Each level of Training (DX) is +1 to all DX-based skills that you have invested at least [1] or more in; Training (IQ) is similar, but for all IQ-, Will-, and Per-based skills. This is treated exactly like having bought up the skill for purposes of things like defaults, floating to another attribute, qualifying for damage/ST bonuses for high skill, etc. A character with Broadsword at DX+2 [8] and Training 2 (DX) [30] is functionally the same (as it relates to Broadsword) as one with Broadsword at DX+4 [16].
Note HT-based skills aren't represented above. You could probably roll them together with DX-based (making the specializations Body vs Mind rather than DX vs IQ) without any serious issues. I originally felt that training up HT-based skills should increase HT, so there wouldn't be an issue just leaving things as-is, but now that I look at it again, I realize that's problematic for when (for example) an expert hiker has to float Hiking to IQ for packing things up efficiently. If he just got Hiking (and some other skills) to HT+2 and then bought up HT from there, he'd only be at IQ+2 - professional, assuming average IQ, instead of the expert-level he should be at.
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06-02-2021, 05:30 PM | #33 | |
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Sumter, SC
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Re: Skill Advancement
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ST: measures physical power and bulk. DX: measures a combination of agility, coordination, and fine motor ability. IQ: broadly measures brainpower, including creativity, intuition, memory, perception, reason, sanity, and willpower. HT: measures energy and vitali- ty. It represents stamina, resistance (to poison, disease, radiation, etc.), and basic “grit.” Albert Einstein was only given an IQ 15 while Leonardo Da Vinci and Sir Isaac Newton were given IQs of 18 (with talents you could, IMHO, shave some IQ from those but the conversions just used the stats as its for simplicity)
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06-03-2021, 07:19 AM | #34 | |
Join Date: May 2021
Location: Eastern Kentucky
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Re: Skill Advancement
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Another option would be to just set the max at 20 by default unless the skill itself overrides that limit. |
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06-03-2021, 09:14 AM | #35 | |
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ronkonkoma, NY
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Re: Skill Advancement
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And if you're playing in a game where Broadsword-40 is affordable, I don't see why the foes can't also have Broadsword-40. Or Explosive Fireball-40. Anyway, the Basic Set on page 172 suggests the GM limit starting PC skills to somewhere between 20-25 to encourage a more realistic breadth of skill. |
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06-03-2021, 09:26 AM | #36 |
Join Date: Jun 2013
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Re: Skill Advancement
You could also set a "typical" max - say, 16, for experts - then charge an increasing-in-cost Unusual Background for having anything above that. Perhaps it's [+1] (total [5] for +1 skill) for 17, [+2] (total [6] for +1 skill) for 18, [+3] (total [7] for +1 skill) for 19, and so forth. This is independent of attribute - if you have DX 18 and put [1] in a DX/E skill (like Knife), it's actually at 16 unless you pay the Unusual Background cost (at the same time, a character with DX 10 can get all the way to DX+6 before needing to pay for UB). Or increase more gradually, such as [1] in UB per +1 above 16, then [2] in UB per +1 above 20, [3] per +1 above 24, etc; whichever works best for you.
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06-03-2021, 12:59 PM | #37 | |||
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Cambridge, MA
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Re: Skill Advancement
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But none of those templates jack up weapon skills that high. Which makes it relatively easy to make a 250 character that bests a DF Swashbuckler or Knight in a toe-to-toe fight pretty much every time, even though those templates are purportedly designed to help you make optimized melee fighters. Quote:
But the problem is, the rest of the system is not well-built to handle fighters with skill-40. The prebuilt monsters in DF all get crushed by a character like that, so you have to rebuild them all. The spells in Magic all tend to assume both the caster and anyone else in the neighborhood have skills below 20, so spells like Create Warrior become useless (the "warriors" are speedbumps at best), a Shield spell that gives you a mere +3 DB pales in comparison to -12 to defenses you have from a Deceptive Attack, etc., etc. Quote:
This is why I favor using the 3e progression for weapon skills and spells. You actually have to think about whether it's worth buying sky-high skill, and it becomes possible to compete even if you focused on attributes, advantages, a diversity of skills, etc. |
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06-03-2021, 01:58 PM | #38 | ||||
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ronkonkoma, NY
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Re: Skill Advancement
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Make no mistake: if you sink all those points into Broadsword skill, you will be sacrificing important abilities elsewhere. You will be extremely specialized, which will work well until you find yourself in a situation you aren't specialized for. On the other hand, if all the GM ever does is throw monsters at you that you can just hack down, then sure, having Broadsword-40 is a no-brainer. Quote:
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06-03-2021, 02:17 PM | #39 | |
Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Iceland*
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Re: Skill Advancement
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06-03-2021, 02:35 PM | #40 | |
Join Date: Jun 2013
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Re: Skill Advancement
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That said, I'm largely fine with the way GURPS 4e prices skills (I feel it has too many skills, but that's a different discussion). As GM, if someone handed me a character with Broadsword-40 for use in a DF setting or similar, I'd probably laugh, hand the sheet back, and ask them to create a more balanced character (and try to help them with it). I wouldn't want to put any hard limits on skill, even in the form of Unusual Background surcharges, but a character with one skill so far in excess of all the others wouldn't pass review.
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