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Old 08-10-2021, 11:55 PM   #21
maximara
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Default Re: [Magic] Development of Spell-based Magic through TL0

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Originally Posted by Prince Charon View Post
Depends on the setting (or rather, what the GM and players want it to be). For purposes of this thread generically, the mana field is a natural particle field that exists on this Earth (GURPS Technomancer called them 'oz particles,' IIRC), and may extend beyond it. The higher the particle density in an area, the higher the mana level.
This last part is IMHO key to development of TL0 magic spells. A very low mana world is going to have a totally different dynamic than a wild mana one.

Look at pokemon's setting as being the result of mana and you start to see the issue with a lot of magic endowed critters running around. Kind of nasty when you think you have that fox like thing cornered and it demonstrates its innate magic Flame Jet right in your face (Flareon)

Early shaman wizards may have "familiars" that serve as living powerstones or give them other benefits.
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Old 02-11-2023, 02:13 AM   #22
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Default Re: [Magic] Development of Spell-based Magic through TL0

Thinking about the effects of spells on Stone Age cultures: Imagine a Neolithic proto-civilization with some Earth Shamans who specialize in a few basic spells - Seek Earth -> Shape Earth -> Earth to Stone -> Stone to Earth, with maybe an older shaman who knows Predict Earth Movement if that's something they need to worry about frequently enough. They most likely don't use Earth to Stone to turn stone to metal, and indeed, their version of the spell might not be able to.

Construction is still difficult and tiring, but it isn't nearly as slow, and if they have Engineer (Civil)/TL0^, it's probably fairly safe. They probably still assemble buildings out of stone blocks (since shaping heavier quantities of earth is more tiring), but the blocks are whatever shape they need them to be, without the need to carve the stones.

Also, they likely skipped over the development of pottery, since making stone jars and such in whatever shape is required is easy for them. Stone weapons or tools are another matter, since the description in the book is vague beyond 'hard stone' that isn't gemstone - given the apparent importance of polished jade axes in the Neolithic, there might still be a market for toolmakers - or it may be that the mages just don't have time with the other stuff that they need to make or do.


Thoughts?
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Old 02-11-2023, 06:44 AM   #23
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Default Re: [Magic] Development of Spell-based Magic through TL0

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Originally Posted by Prince Charon View Post
Thinking about the effects of spells on Stone Age cultures: Imagine a Neolithic proto-civilization with some Earth Shamans who specialize in a few basic spells - Seek Earth -> Shape Earth -> Earth to Stone -> Stone to Earth, with maybe an older shaman who knows Predict Earth Movement if that's something they need to worry about frequently enough. They most likely don't use Earth to Stone to turn stone to metal, and indeed, their version of the spell might not be able to.

Construction is still difficult and tiring, but it isn't nearly as slow, and if they have Engineer (Civil)/TL0^, it's probably fairly safe. They probably still assemble buildings out of stone blocks (since shaping heavier quantities of earth is more tiring), but the blocks are whatever shape they need them to be, without the need to carve the stones.

Also, they likely skipped over the development of pottery, since making stone jars and such in whatever shape is required is easy for them. Stone weapons or tools are another matter, since the description in the book is vague beyond 'hard stone' that isn't gemstone - given the apparent importance of polished jade axes in the Neolithic, there might still be a market for toolmakers - or it may be that the mages just don't have time with the other stuff that they need to make or do.


Thoughts?
I'd go ahead and let them shape jadeite and nephrite. This site.....

https://www.gemsociety.org/article/s...mohs-hardness/

has those stones at 6 to 6 and 1/2 Mohs. that's behind quartz and only a little ahead of magnetite and hematite which I am sure have decorative forms but are mostly just iron ore.

If you just have to have and a hard (pun intended) and fast line I'd draw it at over 7 on the Mohs scale. Diamond is way up at 10 and your stone age people have to discover it first and probably aren't impressed with it if they do find it.

They might know emerald and that's at over 7. That might be their idea of "unshapeable gemstone".
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Old 02-12-2023, 01:28 AM   #24
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Default Re: [Magic] Development of Spell-based Magic through TL0

Does Earth to Stone actually allow you to pick the type of stone, or not?
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Old 02-12-2023, 01:49 AM   #25
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Default Re: [Magic] Development of Spell-based Magic through TL0

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Does Earth to Stone actually allow you to pick the type of stone, or not?
Well, not if you try to pick a gemstone (or, for that matter, a soft stone). It also doesn't specify if "you" is the caster or the fates, the player or the GM.

So the GM has a pretty open field on this one.
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