death is great!??!?!

[harliquin76]

there being no real death penalty in the game seems to make dieing a good thing. example: last night we had someone who died at lvl 6 lost the one card in his hand and he didnt have any items on the board. then on his next turn he gets 4 new items and 4 new door cards. he then pulls his door card and its nothing bad. he then sells his 4 treasure cards for 3 lvls and fights a lvl 1 monster in his hand there by winning the game. after checking this its possible to win like this about 70% of the time. there should be some levels lost on death. thinking of a new house rule of atleast half levels lost rounded up.

[Morfeatire]

Its not easy to die on purpose, but yes, sometimes death can be a blessing on Munchkin.

Believe-me, you'll slow your games down for nothing as this specific situation is pretty rare.

[EarthStone]

Yes, that is a very rare occurrence where you can make it to level 6 and have no items in play. I think his winning in that manner is more rare than someone winning for being a level 9 cleric and having Divine Intervention show up. Sure it could happen, but so rarely that it doesn't break the game.

I'd suggest that if you're so convinced that dying is a good thing, before you make a house rule of losing levels when you die, go ahead and play several games where you actively try to die and see what the results are. Losing all your items and your hand, while the other players loot your corpse, should change your opinion in short order.

[wmkane]

Originally Posted by harliquin76

there being no real death penalty in the game seems to make dieing a good thing. example: last night we had someone who died at lvl 6 lost the one card in his hand and he didnt have any items on the board. then on his next turn he gets 4 new items and 4 new door cards. he then pulls his door card and its nothing bad. he then sells his 4 treasure cards for 3 lvls and fights a lvl 1 monster in his hand there by winning the game. after checking this its possible to win like this about 70% of the time. there should be some levels lost on death. thinking of a new house rule of atleast half levels lost rounded up.

I think this was a pretty rare occurrence. You shouldn't dwell on it too much. If you think it's an odd way to win, remember that the name of the game is Munchkin.

And yes, the game-makers did intend for Death to be a "GOOD" thing in some instances. Why else would they make cards like "Rocks Fall, Everyone Dies" or "Poison Tooth"? Personally, I had a very difficult time the first time I played Munchkin Impossible. I got the Poison Tooth card and wasn't quite sure how to use it, or why I would want to kill myself. I held onto it, and later in the game, I had exhausted all of my monster enhancers, wandering monsters, and traps to use on the lead player who was level 9. We all had exhausted our cards. I played poison tooth on myself and got cards to stop her from winning. Instead another player won.

[jerrybeansman]

Death is supposed to be a way to even out the odds for those level 6-er's with nothing going for them. Lets say that level 6 with no items dropped to level 1 (or half his levels, like your possible house rule). Then he's pushed even further out of the game. At that point he's welcome to go to the bathroom and get a snack because there's slim to no chance of him winning.

Munchkin is designed to be dungeon looting fun without all the complicated stuff. A more casual RPG-style game. I think extreme death (lose all your items, levels and cards) would turn off a lot of newbie players or make the game less fun for certain people.

Death rarely occurs in our games. Most of us are happy to help out and keep people in our games, and only level 9's close to victory lose.

You could always incorporate some Munchkin Quest death rules like we do sometimes.
Death = only one level loss and one less Door and one less Treasure on your respawn redraw.

[Nerftw]

Originally Posted by harliquin76

after checking this its possible to win like this about 70% of the time.

That's a pretty specific statistic you have there. Anything to back it up with? You'd have to assume that two conditions are met:

Not having many cards, and facing a monster with death as the bad stuff.

Not to mention the odds of having 3000 gold in items with only four cards.

Given how few monsters have death as bad stuff, and how few items are that expensive, the odds are far more likely that you'd wind up facing him with cards you don't want to lose.

[majikfreak]

Death... Death... Death...

The group I play with, well 3 of the 7 try like hell to get people killed... I personally don't mind dieing. Know I'm gonna get fresh cards on my next turn.

I just recently bought 3 Reloaded boosters back and will add them to my decks. So we will have that many more ways to kill people... We also play with a house rule that all loaded dice can be played on any roll. So you may think you are gonna run away, but you ain't... We play very cutthroat in my group. We have a lot of fun, talking trash and killin ****... I just with I had a few more Annihilation and Dogpile cards for my deck.

[ComBAT]

I think that it really depends on the number of people you play with I suppose. My group and I have found death to be quite preferable later on in the game. Getting someone killed at level 9 is very dangerous if the result isn't in level loss. Even at level 6 - 9 them receiving 8 new cards can mean so many things. They could 4 or fewer GUAL cards, low level monsters to look for trouble with, and any cards that can help protect them in their next battle against other cards thrown at them.

Death may not be that often, but you are not required to try and win battles especially if you think dying and getting 8 new cards will help you. Before attempting to run away, you are also welcome to use as many cards as you legally can that are in your hand so the other players can't get them to use against you later. I think the 4 Door and 4 Treasure cards makes death a little too tempting sometimes. This is a recent rule change too, no? Death is not nearly as attractive if you only received 2 of each card type when it's your next turn.

I agree, Death is not nearly as painful as it seems to be made. And if you are killed with tons of equipment, that only means everyone used up most of their cards to try and stop you and must hope they can acquire more cards to stop you next time. It only takes one low level monster that you find when you kick down a door or when you look for trouble in order for the level 9 to win.

So basically, if you are playing with 6 players and you are killed, that is 5 other players that are available to try and stop you from winning after you get 8 new cards. If you are in a game of 4 players, those 8 cards you get make a world of difference and you are much more difficult to stop without the extra players.

[Palmer]

Originally Posted by harliquin76

there being no real death penalty in the game seems to make dieing a good thing. example: last night we had someone who died at lvl 6 lost the one card in his hand and he didnt have any items on the board.

He had no items? Then how did he even reach Level 6?

Odds are he should have gotten 3-4 treasure cards by that point... on top of the 4 he started with.

In general, death sucks because it's a setback. You lose all the items you had (which can be a lot) PLUS everyone else gets stronger by looting your body.

Having a situation where you have nothing to lose and everything to gain is extremely contrived and rare. Sometimes it works out, like in this story. Most of the time, you're screwed.

[MunchkinMan]

Originally Posted by Palmer

He had no items? Then how did he even reach Level 6?

Odds are he should have gotten 3-4 treasure cards by that point... on top of the 4 he started with.

Not if he sold his Items some time prior to dying. Or was an Elf who had good one-shot Items or Monster Enhancers, or only needed to offer a small amount of combat strength as a helper. Or, he got a fair amount of GUAL cards at the outset. Or, he only got one-shot Items and GUALs from combats he won. It's not so inconceivable to get to Level 6 with practically nothing. I've made it to Level 8 once, with GUALs, lucky Monster draws, and one +2 Item.

In general, death sucks because it's a setback. You lose all the items you had (which can be a lot) PLUS everyone else gets stronger by looting your body.

Having a situation where you have nothing to lose and everything to gain is extremely contrived and rare. Sometimes it works out, like in this story. Most of the time, you're screwed.

I will agree that there are times when Death is a good thing, no doubt. However, to claim it's the best thing ever in 100% of all cases is a claim that holds less water than a sieve with large holes and no blockages. Sometimes it requires significant effort to get Death to work in your favor, sometimes it just happens, but not often.