Real Magic!

[Street]

I would like to work with other writers to create a new gurps
book about magic. I have created 12 types of magic that are
intended to represent magic as it exists in the real world.
Each type of power exists in two forms, Vulgar & Coincidental.
The coincidental magic is easier to use and does not draw
attention. The vulgar magic goes beyond that level and is
harder to actually cast. Here are the twelve powers, and
below this basic list is some explanation and fluff. At
the end you will find a link to example spells.

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Powers
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Prediction: Wisdom / ESP
Feeling: Empathy / Telepathy
Production: Attraction / Creation
Influence: Charisma / Hypnotism
Penetration: Escape / Intangibility
Control: Energy / Telekinesis
Restoration: Renewal / Healing
Vanishing: Stealth / Invisibility
Travel: Direction / Teleportation
Transformation: Developing / Shapeshifting
Destruction: Curses / Annihilation
Revelation: Visions / Rapture

The presented magic system offers an alternative framework for
magic in the GURPS role-playing game, providing players and game
masters with a fresh and dynamic approach to spellcasting.
Departing from the traditional GURPS magic rules, this system
introduces the concept of 12 magic powers, offering a more nuanced and
customizable experience for characters delving into the arcane
arts.

The powers shape a character's magical abilities, acting as
specialized paths or schools of magic. Each power provides a unique
set of spells related to its specific theme or focus.

Characters have the freedom to create their own spells, allowing
for a wide range of magical possibilities limited only by their
imagination and the Powers they have proficiency in.

Presented below is a an expanded explanation of the Powers:

Power of Prediction - Wisdom/ESP
Realization - Unveiling the inner knowledge within.

The Power of Prediction manifests as inspiration and insight,
granting effortless access to answers and discoveries beyond
conventional understanding. It endows the practitioner with
the gift of foreknowledge. The key to unlocking this power
lies in the realization that all knowledge already resides
within oneself.


Power of Feeling - Empathy/Telepathy
Association - Recognizing the interconnectedness of all things.

The Power of Feeling enables one to empathize and understand
others deeply, perceiving their thoughts and emotions without
the need for words. It stems from the profound insight into
the Association, the intrinsic link that binds all living
beings together.


Power of Production - Attraction/Creation
Synchronicity - Uniting the threads of existence.

The Power of Production empowers a wizard to draw situations and
desires into their reality. This ability stems from a profound
understanding of Synchronicity, the cosmic principle that
everything is interconnected and influences each other. It
acknowledges that the power to attract lies within, awaiting
manifestation.


Power of Influence - Charisma/Hypnotism
Possession - Will shaping the realm of the mind.

The Power of Influence grants a wizard the power to captivate others.
Known as Possession, it allows one to enchant and charm,
eliciting positive perceptions or even gaining control over
another's thoughts and actions. The essence of this mastery
lies in the understanding that one's will can wield dominion
over the minds of others.

Power of Penetration - Escape/Intangibility
Spiritualism - Perceiving the world as a realm of spirit.

The Power of Penetration delves into the realm of Spiritualism.
It unveils the truth that the world is fundamentally composed
of spirit, allowing a wizard to transcend physical boundaries
and become intangible. Chains and locks lose their hold,
dissolving effortlessly under the wizard's touch.


Power of Control - Energy/Telekinesis
Evocation - Harnessing the forces of the spiritual realm.

The Power of Control enables a wizard to command powerful forces.
Through evocation, the practitioner can manipulate energy and bend
it to their will. This understanding arises from recognizing that
spiritual entities are themselves embodiments of force and possess
the capacity to shape and impact the physical world.


Power of Restoration - Renewal/Healing
Forgiveness - Liberating from suffering caused by transgressions.

The Power of Restoration holds the gift of healing. It grants the
ability to alleviate pain, cure diseases, and bring renewal to the
afflicted. This power emerges from the understanding of Forgiveness,
recognizing that suffering often stems from transgressions. By
embracing forgiveness, a wizard becomes a conduit for healing and
restoration.


Power of Vanishing - Stealth/Invisibility
Misdirection - Manipulating attention and perception.

The Power of Vanishing encompasses the art of Misdirection. It
allows a wizard to control focus and attention, rendering
themselves unseen and secrets concealed. Meticulous study and
practice grant the ability to achieve complete invisibility as the
wizard manipulates perception and directs attention elsewhere.


Power of Travel - Direction/Teleportation
Unity - Dissolving the illusion of separation.

The Power of Travel operates on the understanding that all separation
is illusory. By harnessing this power, a wizard can navigate without
traditional directions and locate objects or places that are lost or
hidden. A skilled practitioner can transcend distance, stepping from
one location to any desired destination.


Power of Transformation - Developing/Shapeshifting
Personification - Authoring one's own identity.

The Power of Transformation allows a wizard to assume the form and
essence of another being, whether it be an abstract concept, an
animal, or even a deity. The essence of this mastery lies in the
understanding that one has the power to create and define their own
identity, refusing to be shaped by external forces. The power of
transformation can also be used to improve who you already are.


Power of Destruction - Curses/Annihilation
Pragmatism - Dissolving the constructs of right and wrong.

The Power of Destruction holds immense power that should be wielded
with caution. It encompasses the ability to curse, annihilate, and
disrupt the natural order. However, the utilization of this power
draws one away from their true path and blurs the distinction
between right and wrong.


Power of Revelation - Visions/Rapture
Above as Below - The symbiotic connection between gods, angels, and humanity.

The Power of Revelation unveils profound visions and grants
enlightenment to the practitioner. It is rooted in the
understanding of the symbiotic connection between gods, angels,
and humanity. By tapping into this power, a wizard gains access
to celestial knowledge, perceiving the intricate tapestry that
binds all realms and entities together.


To read example spells
go to: https://www.coreywhitemagic.com/examples.txt

[Inky]

It seems like, you've posted this umpteen times but I still can't work out whether by "real-world magic" you mean ESP etc. or conjuring. Which did you mean, do you know? It seems like, you talk rather as if you mean conjuring but that wouldn't make sense for a lot of the things you list.

[Street]

Originally Posted by Inky

It seems like, you've posted this umpteen times but I still can't work out whether by "real-world magic" you mean ESP etc. or conjuring. Which did you mean, do you know? It seems like, you talk rather as if you mean conjuring but that wouldn't make sense for a lot of the things you list.

First, I haven't posted this umpteen times. Also I assume you mean sleight of hand by "conjuring", and Psi by "esp". I'm not talking about either. I'm writing about magic, and a system that can allow for literally any effect to fall into one of these categories.

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by Street

First, I haven't posted this umpteen times.

Maybe not "umpteen" times but you have done this before because I recognize that page you linked to.

However much this makes sense t you it doesn't make sense to me as _game mechanics_ and other people might have similar problems.

Among these problems might also be that I've never seen "real magic" in the "real world".

I suspect you need to _explain_ more than you have.

[Street]

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

Maybe not "umpteen" times but you have done this before because I recognize that page you linked to.

However much this makes sense t you it doesn't make sense to me as _game mechanics_ and other people might have similar problems.

Among these problems might also be that I've never seen "real magic" in the "real world".

I suspect you need to _explain_ more than you have.

The use of "real magic" in GURPS isn't my idea. It is a reference to another GURPS book, "Authentic Thaumaturgy": https://www.sjgames.com/thaumaturgy/

[Inky]

Possibly, it makes more sense now, thanks - I'd looked at your main page and it was all links to stuff about mentalism, stage magic and lock-picking, so I got the wrong idea.

The astrology doesn't seem to be there this time. Is that on purpose? The astrological pattern was kind of awesome. I don't think it was that that was the problem. More the lack of game mechanics causing people to not know what you're trying to do with this. This still seems to be pretty much devoid of game mechanics, in fact more so than last time. Is that one of the things you wanted other people to help with?

[Fred Brackin]

Originally Posted by Street

The use of "real magic" in GURPS isn't my idea. It is a reference to another GURPS book, "Authentic Thaumaturgy": https://www.sjgames.com/thaumaturgy/

Authentic Thaumaturgy isn't a Gurps book. To quote from the page you linked to....

"It is not part of the GURPS system, or any other specific game, so any GM who likes modifying his game's magic systems will get a lot of ideas here."

I first encountered it around 1980 (well before Gurps was created). Back then the creators of Chivalry & Sorcery 1e had sort of adopted it as one of the main sources for their magic system (which has similarities to Gurps Magic really only in some of its' organisation). This can be seen in the Elemental Colleges and the progression of Spells there with increasingly sophisticated manipulations following simple ones..

[Pursuivant]

As constructive criticism, there isn't enough information on your web site for playtesters or commenters to work with.

The spell ideas seem reasonable, but they're just ideas for standard GURPS Magic, Ritual/Path magic spells, or Powers/Sorcery. Flesh them out with game statistics and you'll get more more positive response to requests for feedback.

If you're not familiar with designing spells, ask for help with a particular spell and the folks on this forum will be glad to walk you through the process.

If you're using the standard GURPS Magic format as a base, many of your ideas are just variations on existing spells or new spells that would temporarily grant certain advantages.

My rule of thumb for "Bestow Advantage" type spells is 3-5 second casting time for traits with combat utility, 5-10 seconds for non-combat traits. Duration is 10 second or 1 minute duration for traits useful in combat or 10 minutes or 1 hour for traits useful in a non-combat context. Casting cost is 1 FP per 5 character points of traits bestowed, with half cost to maintain in most cases.

As an example:

Insight Regular
Knowledge College
Gives the subject the effects of a successful use of the Intuition advantage (p. B61) to identify a likely path to success prior to performing a specific task. For the spell to work, the subject must have a decent grasp of the problem they're trying to solve and possible approaches to solving it. They must also meditate on the problem for at least 1 minute before the spell is cast. Failure to do so means the spell fails.

In game terms, the subject's player must lay out potential actions their character can take to solve a particular immediate problem or the choices must be obvious (e.g., Which door do I choose? Which suspect should I interview first?). On a successful casting, the GM must choose the solution which best helps the player (or character) solve their immediate problem. If multiple options are equally good, the GM can choose among them. If none of the stated options are good the spell fails but the caster will know why.

Duration: Instantaneous. The subject must meditate on a particular problem for 1 minute before the spell can be cast.
Cost: 3. Can't be maintained.
Time to Cast: 10 seconds.
Prerequisite: Divination.

[namada]

Originally Posted by Fred Brackin

"Coincidental" magic is not obviously a violation of the laws of physics or at least is not cast in front of non-magical witnesses. "Vulgar" magic is probably both and Reality doesn't like that sort of thing and may inflict backlash on the user.

This is a big deal in original M:tA (i.e. 30 years ago for the Gurps version).

Also, while the game system could be fully flexible and improvisational some casters and some traditions depended on "rotes" which are pre-set magic "spells" with the actual mechanics embedded in the Sphere system..

It just came to me as I started to write this that the OP was producing a list of "rotes" (though he never used that word). He was trying to use some old G:WoD books he'd found but apparently no one here was sufficiently immersed in these 30 year old game mechanics to grasp what he was doing. I think "rotes" were virtually ignored in the M:tA port in Thaumatology.

My personal reasons for not recognizing this sooner were not only that it was half a lifetime ago (more for most of you whipper-snappers) but I hated subjective reality and Mage manipulation of it when i stumbled across it back in the 90s.

Honestly, that seems to fit exactly what I was remembering, I just didn't have the words to express that atm, because I wasn't certain about it...
So, I guess, thanks for saying what I needed to say...?

Originally Posted by Kallatari

The really quick adaptation of Mage: The Ascension magic in GURPS would be:

- Use Syntatic Magic: Realms and Power (GURPS Thaumatology, p.188-191), where the Realms are the Spheres. If memory serves, there where 9 Spheres that had 5 levels each. If we adapt that as 9 Realms with 5 levels, then they would be worth (12 x level) points each. I'd personally just stick with the 6 levels per Realms as defined on p.189, in which case the Realms would be worth (10 x level) points each.
- Use Reactive Reality (GURPS Thaumatology, p.193-194) to account for "vulgar" vs "coincidental" magic to receive Distortion points.
- Apply the generic Syntatic modifiers (GURPS Thaumatology, p.180-183, or tables p.242-243) as skills penalties (rather than energy cost modifiers or required margin of success), and you can then buy off those penalties for a pre-determined effect as a Technique which represents a "rote."

From there, you can customize your own variant system by customizing the Realms and the number of levels they have. You could also customize the effects of Distortion Points, and how to get rid of them.

Yes, however, Street also did say that he/she/it was trying to adapt the book "Authentic Thaumaturgy" not WoD magic in any form, so this is only kinda helpful. I did own that particular book at one time, no longer, and as others have said, I found it to be too focused on 1960s+ spiritual/mystic magic ideas & didn't enjoy the thing overall. With that said, if Street likes it and wants to use it with GURPS, that is perfectly possible, so let's help Street with that.

[Donny Brook]

Originally Posted by Street

I would like to work with other writers to create a new gurps book about magic. I have created 12 types of magic ...

You have posted about this twice before with similar replies. Unfortunately, you do not seem to have taken action in response to the replies.

What continues to be missing is operationalizing your ideas into the form of rules that can be used at the gaming table.

Perhaps an example would help. Pick one of your spells and explain, step by step, how an equipped character would use it in play, including particulars such as choice of Maneuver, time taken to prepare and cast, when and against what to roll for success, the specific results of a success or failure (including duration, area affected, levels of damage or whatever).