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Old 11-02-2021, 09:03 AM   #11
whswhs
 
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Default Re: test driving GURPS Realm Management

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Originally Posted by Christopher R. Rice View Post
This is either the "Fertile Territory" or "Habitable Land" enhancements on p. 25 of GURPS Realm Management.
I don't think I see how that affects the maximum sustainable carrying capacity. Say that I want Pavonis Portal, at TL10, to have a carrying capacity of 1200 per square mile, rather than 600. How would you use either of those traits to let it sustain itself at that higher density? I'm trying to read the published rules, but I'm not seeing where they give that result.
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Old 11-02-2021, 09:14 AM   #12
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Default Re: test driving GURPS Realm Management

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I don't think I see how that affects the maximum sustainable carrying capacity. Say that I want Pavonis Portal, at TL10, to have a carrying capacity of 1200 per square mile, rather than 600. How would you use either of those traits to let it sustain itself at that higher density? I'm trying to read the published rules, but I'm not seeing where they give that result.
Ahhh. Ok. That's "Higher/Lower Carrying Capacity" also on p. 25. You'd need two levels of it as that's TL12 (the max at 1,200 people/sq mile)
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Old 11-02-2021, 09:16 AM   #13
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Default Re: test driving GURPS Realm Management

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But it seems that the orbital elevator itself is a resource of some kind. Do you just ignore it?
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Its not a finite expendable resource though. Resource points are consumable and don't automatically regenerate. The orbital elevator is a static resource that generates wealth depending on the outer economy.
You could treat it a New Trade Connection windfall (p. 42) or as the Clear Routes enhancement (p. 25)
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Old 11-02-2021, 05:07 PM   #14
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Default Re: test driving GURPS Realm Management

Here's one more thing that's come up: Using GURPS Space, I find that Mars's habitability rating is unfavorable enough so that its standard of living is reduced by 40% by the costs of survival/scarcity of resources; that is, rather than having a monthly income of $5600, its people have a monthly income of $3360. How would you represent this in GURPS RM terms? Does it have any effect at all on the Habitability score for the realm, or is that something quite different?
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Old 11-02-2021, 07:41 PM   #15
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Default Re: test driving GURPS Realm Management

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Here's one more thing that's come up: Using GURPS Space, I find that Mars's habitability rating is unfavorable enough so that its standard of living is reduced by 40% by the costs of survival/scarcity of resources; that is, rather than having a monthly income of $5600, its people have a monthly income of $3360. How would you represent this in GURPS RM terms? Does it have any effect at all on the Habitability score for the realm, or is that something quite different?
It could affect Habitability, but Habitability isn't what is just natural to the environment, it's also what the environment has been made. You could have a Habitability of Excellent with domed cities being paradise while outside is unlivable. You could also lower the inhabitants status and wealth to represent this.

I suppose you could represent it also be represented by reducing the Realm Value (and thus other calculations like Revenue) by 40%, but that's just off the top of my head. It probably wouldn't break anything.
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Old 11-02-2021, 08:44 PM   #16
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Default Re: test driving GURPS Realm Management

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It could affect Habitability, but Habitability isn't what is just natural to the environment, it's also what the environment has been made. You could have a Habitability of Excellent with domed cities being paradise while outside is unlivable. You could also lower the inhabitants status and wealth to represent this.

I suppose you could represent it also be represented by reducing the Realm Value (and thus other calculations like Revenue) by 40%, but that's just off the top of my head. It probably wouldn't break anything.
I was kind of hoping that there was already a limitation that would have this effect, but I haven't been able to find one.

I'm trying to make GURPS Space, GURPS City States, and GURPS Realm Management all fit together smoothly, but I'm not sure I can make that happen.

I did suspect that Habitability could be interpreted that way; it didn't seem to be what I was looking for. Is there perhaps a crisis that could be interpreted as "habitability has fallen precipitously, needs urgent repairs"?
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Old 11-02-2021, 09:14 PM   #17
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Default Re: test driving GURPS Realm Management

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I was kind of hoping that there was already a limitation that would have this effect, but I haven't been able to find one.
No, but I've made a note to include it in any follow-ups I write for Realm Management. You shouldn't really need a limitation - just adjust the value of the realm to match the reduced monthly pay. Mechanically, that's all you need unless there is some other reason I'm not seeing or you have not said.

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I'm trying to make GURPS Space, GURPS City States, and GURPS Realm Management all fit together smoothly, but I'm not sure I can make that happen.
GURPS Space is almost 20 years old and RM was never meant to really totally mesh with it. It takes a different approach to describing localities than my book does. City Stats doesn't have a lot of super crunch - like RM it's meant to describe a locality in broadish terms so it should be compatible. What are you having issues with for it exactly?

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I did suspect that Habitability could be interpreted that way; it didn't seem to be what I was looking for. Is there perhaps a crisis that could be interpreted as "habitability has fallen precipitously, needs urgent repairs"?
Sure. Just buy the Habitability down to whatever and make a note in the notes section of the realm that it was X, but is currently Y because of Z. Then repair it whenever in game play (if it can be repaired) by buying off the limitation and spending time on it.
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Old 11-03-2021, 04:24 AM   #18
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Default Re: test driving GURPS Realm Management

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GURPS Space is almost 20 years old and RM was never meant to really totally mesh with it. It takes a different approach to describing localities than my book does. City Stats doesn't have a lot of super crunch - like RM it's meant to describe a locality in broadish terms so it should be compatible. What are you having issues with for it exactly?
Well, as far as GURPS Space is concerned, it's only the one point: average planetary income is reduced to reflect the cost of basic life support in a lethally hostile environment. I've figured out a workaround for reconciling that with City Stats, and your point about realm income seems well taken.

But what I did originally was to write up Pavonis Portal as an example city in GURPS City Stats, using (obviously) GURPS City Stats statistics. Now, I'm trying to write it up as a realm using GURPS Realm Management, to see if I learn anything useful by doing so. But the writeup needs to "save the appearances": to produce results that are consistent with the information in City Stats. And I'm not sure how to do that. I've taken some notes toward doing an RM writeup, but I'm not really sure I'm doing it right.
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Old 11-03-2021, 07:13 AM   #19
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Default Re: test driving GURPS Realm Management

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Well, as far as GURPS Space is concerned, it's only the one point: average planetary income is reduced to reflect the cost of basic life support in a lethally hostile environment. I've figured out a workaround for reconciling that with City Stats, and your point about realm income seems well taken.
Excellent.

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But what I did originally was to write up Pavonis Portal as an example city in GURPS City Stats, using (obviously) GURPS City Stats statistics. Now, I'm trying to write it up as a realm using GURPS Realm Management, to see if I learn anything useful by doing so. But the writeup needs to "save the appearances": to produce results that are consistent with the information in City Stats. And I'm not sure how to do that. I've taken some notes toward doing an RM writeup, but I'm not really sure I'm doing it right.
I mean, I'm happy to help you however I can. If there are particular sticking points we can list them out and I'll help you go through them line by line. Realm Management was meant to work with GURPS Boardrooms and Curia, GURPS City Stats, and GURPS Mass Combat. We might have to bend a few things, but I am confidant we can get a good approximation using my book to recreate what was in yours.
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Old 11-03-2021, 07:28 AM   #20
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Default Re: test driving GURPS Realm Management

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I mean, I'm happy to help you however I can. If there are particular sticking points we can list them out and I'll help you go through them line by line. Realm Management was meant to work with GURPS Boardrooms and Curia, GURPS City Stats, and GURPS Mass Combat. We might have to bend a few things, but I am confidant we can get a good approximation using my book to recreate what was in yours.
Thanks! I'll get back to you.
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