Whip of draining

[hcobb]

Is a whip knock over sufficient tied up for Drain ST?

[Skarg]

The person being drained must cooperate or be subjugated (tied up,
unconscious, etc.).

I don't think so, since they are just one 3/DX roll away from being free. That does not meet the standard of "tied up", to me.

Also:

The wizard, the victim, and the figure (if other than the wizard) receiving ST must all be adjacent to one another.

On the other hand, if they're not able to make that 3/DX roll for some number of turns (e.g. because their adjDX is bad for whatever reason), and you are able to stand next to them, perhaps that is enough.

<sarcasm>
On the other hand, lasso/whip attacks are generally ridiculously overpowered due to the overly simple way they're written and/or weren't playtested enough to show how powerful they are. Maybe if the consensus is this DOES work, the day when they get some limits to their powers will come sooner.
</sarcasm>

[David Bofinger]

Originally Posted by hcobb

Is a whip knock over sufficient tied up for Drain ST?

I'd say probably yes, as long as they fail their escape roll that turn. I'd also probably allow it in a HTH pin, a bola round each of arms and legs, or a net. But it's a grey area. I think a Drain Strength magic item of one of those would be kind of cool.

[larsdangly]

Because it sounds like fun, I'd say 'why not!'. But presumably if/when they pry themselves loose your opportunity will have passed.

[RobW]

I’d say definitely not

But, a magic whip equipped with drain strength would be a great item, with lots of thematic opportunities!

[Skarg]

Well, the reason "why not", as with whips/bolas/lassos/nets in general, is that the rules are so underdeveloped that they give a 3/DX roll to automatically knock someone (_anyone / anything_) down and have them take at least two more turns to get back up, and even most of their range penalties are less even than a thrown spell.

Which means they undermine the rest of the game system by just being an easy "takes down anyone" attack.

So adding on top of that, the ability to bend the requirement of Drain Strength to no longer be that someone has to be completely tied up, but can be used in combat, is just adding another level of munchkin abuse. Now not only does your high ST not help you against someone's rope, it's actually a disadvantage because it means you give them more strength to drain.

[hcobb]

And of course I've nerfed these down.

https://www.hcobb.com/tft/house_rules.html#unusual