Talents vs Psionics

[Hanzorigami]

Definitively valuable information Sunrunners and Keeh! Thanks a lot!
I think I understand better now how the stuff in the Psionic Powers supplement works. :) I am glad to see some of my conjectures were right. I'd like to use an example to confirm I got everything right.

I'd like to have True Sight, which is an AntiPsi ability (PP25).
Its cost is 16 points for level 1 and 21 for level 2.
The skill associated is True Sight (Will/Hard).

I need to buy the True Sight ability (requirement) at any of the levels, let's say level 1 for 16 points.

Now, with just that, I could use True Sight as an Advantage and make a success roll against my WILL-6 (I assume the associated Attribute is WILL since the associated skill's Attribute is WILL), and if I succeed, I can use it.

If I'd like to have a bonus, I could either buy some levels of the AntiPsi Talent (5 points/level) to have a bonus or buy the True Sight skill at WILL+x (in order to have an advantage, but I know I could as well buy it at WILL+0 or even WILL-x) paying the cost as a standard Hard skill. I could as well acquire both, the AntiPsi Talent level(s) and Skill at Attribute+x for a better bonus.

Now, I assume that by buying the True Sight ability I could also use Shared Sight (Is this correct?). My thought is that since Shared Sight has no skill associated (just a default) and no cost it is an ability that requires (depends on) having True Sight in order to be used, and that its "cost" is the cost paid to get the True Sight ability.
In this case, how should I proceed if I want to use Shared Sight?
The default is True Sight-5; cannot exceed True Sight.
I know the first True Sight mentioned is the True Sight skill level with a penalization of -5, but what does it mean "cannot exceed True Sight"?
Somehow I think this second True Sight is not the skill, but the actual ability, but yet I do not quite understand how could True Sight-5 exceed True Sight.

I understand that if I have the True Sight ability and the True Sight skill, I could use Shared Sight with a success roll at True Sight-5 (I would yet have to figure out if I am not exceeding True Sight, which so far I do not quite understand), but what if I do not have the True Sight skill? Could I use Shared Sight with a success roll at WILL-6 just like with the True Sight ability?

[Keeh]

Originally Posted by Hanzorigami

In this case, how should I proceed if I want to use Shared Sight?
The default is True Sight-5; cannot exceed True Sight.
I know the first True Sight mentioned is the True Sight skill level with a penalization of -5, but what does it mean "cannot exceed True Sight"?
Somehow I think this second True Sight is not the skill, but the actual ability, but yet I do not quite understand how could True Sight-5 exceed True Sight.

To use Shared Sight, you roll against the Shared Sight technique, which start at True Sight-5, but you can improve that until it's at True Sight (see Techniques in Character p. 229). Usually, you'd also pay 2 FP somewhere in the process (see Psionic Powers p.8)

You can also use the True Sight to do all the things described under Getting Tricky (Psionic Powers p.7).

[lexington]

Originally Posted by Hanzorigami

My thought is that since Shared Sight has no skill associated (just a default) and no cost it is an ability that requires (depends on) having True Sight in order to be used, and that its "cost" is the cost paid to get the True Sight ability.

In this case, how should I proceed if I want to use Shared Sight?
The default is True Sight-5; cannot exceed True Sight.
I know the first True Sight mentioned is the True Sight skill level with a penalization of -5, but what does it mean "cannot exceed True Sight"?
Somehow I think this second True Sight is not the skill, but the actual ability, but yet I do not quite understand how could True Sight-5 exceed True Sight.

Shared Sight is a Technique (B229) that lets you do something special with True Sight. To use it you roll against True Sight Skill -5. If you want to be able to do it more easily you put points into the Shared Sight Technique but cannot raise it above your level of True Sight Skill.

For example you have True Sight (the skill) at 15 and no points in Shared Sight (technique). To use Shared Sight you would roll against True Sight (skill) minus five, so that technique has an effective skill of 10.

If you put points into the technique the penalty would drop. Two points in the technique would make the penalty -4, three would make it -3, four would make it -2 and so on.

[Sunrunners_Fire]

Originally Posted by Hanzorigami

I'd like to have True Sight, which is an AntiPsi ability (PP25).
Its cost is 16 points for level 1 and 21 for level 2.
The skill associated is True Sight (Will/Hard).

Right.

I need to buy the True Sight ability (requirement) at any of the levels, let's say level 1 for 16 points.

Ok.

Now, with just that, I could use True Sight as an Advantage and make a success roll against my WILL (I assume the associated Attribute is WILL since the associated skill's Attribute is WILL), and if I succeed, I can use it.

As Keeh pointed out, you'd check against Will-6 (plus Talent) without the skill. So if you had IQ 10, Will 10, Per 10, Anti-Psi Talent 1, you would want to roll 5 or less to succeed. Doable, hard but doable.

If I'd like a certain advantage, I could either buy some levels of the AntiPsi Talent (5 points/level) to have a bonus or buy the True Sight skill at WILL+x (in order to have an advantage, but I know I could as well buy it at WILL+0 or even WILL-x) paying the cost as a standard Hard skill. I could as well acquire both, the AntiPsi Talent level(s) and Skill at Attribute+x.

Right.

Now, I assume that by buying the True Sight ability I could also use Shared Sight (Is this correct?). My thought is that since Shared Sight has no skill associated (just a default) and no cost it is an ability that requires (depends on) having True Sight in order to be used, and that its "cost" is the cost paid to get the True Sight ability.

Kinda.

Shared Sight is a Technique defaulting from True Sight. (Assuming the stats above:) You would check against Will-6 (without skill) +1 (Anti-Psi Talent) -5 (Shared Sight Technique), for a total of 0-. Not going to happen.

(You also pay 2 fatigue for using a psionic technique. Success or failure.)

Now, if you put 4 character points into training True Sight 10- (Will/Hard) and then put 6 character points into training Shared Sight (True Sight) 10- ... you spend your 2 fatigue to activate the psi technique ... and you roll 11 or under (because of the +1 from Anti-Psi Talent 1) to successfully use the technique.

In this case, how should I proceed if I want to use Shared Sight?
The default is True Sight-5; cannot exceed True Sight.
I know the first True Sight mentioned is the True Sight skill level with a penalization of -5, but what does it mean "cannot exceed True Sight"?
Somehow I think this second True Sight is not the skill, but the actual ability, but yet I do not quite understand how could True Sight-5 exceed True Sight.

Because you can train up the technique as per GURPS Characters page 230 to get rid of the -5 penalty for using that psi technique. For a more worked example, see above. Per the technique description you can't raise the technique any higher than True Sight, meaning you can only buy off the penalty, not having the Shared Sight technique at a higher level than True Sight, you'll only ever need to pay those 6 points no matter what your True Sight skill is at.

I understand that if I have the True Sight ability and the True Sight skill, I could use Shared Sight with a success roll at True Sight-5 (I would yet have to figure out if I am not exceeding True Sight, which so far I do not quite understand), but what if I do not have the True Sight skill? Could I use Shared Sight with a success roll at WILL just like with the True Sight ability?

If your Will was high enough, yes. So, Will 20, -6 (True Sight Default) -5 (Shared Sight Technique) +1 (Anti-Psi Talent 1) comes out to 10 or under to succeed. You still pay the 2 fatigue for activating a psi technique.

[Hanzorigami]

Wow! That explains why I couldn't figure out that part correctly. I have not read anything about techniques yet so I guess I need to read about that first before everything makes sense.
Probably after reading about Techniques, I'll come back with some more questions. Thanks a lot to everyone for your help and patience with me! I really appreciate it a lot! :)

[Hanzorigami]

Ok, I think I got it now. I read about the Psi Techniques (p. PP8) but I thought it was something specific to Psionic Powers, so I didn't really get the overall idea at the moment. Now, after your valuable feedback, I have found out that Psi Techniques are based on the principles of the Techniques that are mentioned in the Basic Set (p. B229), but (obviously) applied to Psionics. I had seen the Techniques section in the Skills chapter of the Basic Set, but I had not read it, that's why I didn't related Psi Techniques to anything in the Basic Set and thought it was a whole different concept applied only to Psionic Powers. Now everything makes sense (all your comments and the things I am reading in the books) and I think I have really understand how all these Psionic Abilities work. Once again thanks a lot to everybody for your time and patience. I am really glad to see that there are people willing to help a newbie like me without judging and with the best of the intentions and I appreciate that a lot. :)