05-14-2021, 08:06 AM | #51 | |
Join Date: Jun 2013
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Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction
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*Incidentally, Obsession: Keep Caster Safe, All The Time +40% is a pretty ridiculous Enhancement for Affliction, as it turns an enemy into an ally for less than it would have cost to disable the enemy instead.
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GURPS Overhaul Last edited by Varyon; 05-14-2021 at 08:29 AM. |
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05-14-2021, 08:43 AM | #52 | ||||||
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Ronkonkoma, NY
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Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction
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He doesn't actually say the word servants, but do you think Lord Sméagol, stronger than Wraiths, is going to be catching his own fish, eh, precious? Let's also remember the primary purpose of the One Ring: it is used to dominate the wills of others. With it, if your power is great enough, you can directly control others who are wearing Rings of Power. You can influence and command the wills of others. If someone already enslaved to the Ring swears by it, you can put it on and command him to do anything, even kill himself. This is what Gollum is envisioning. Quote:
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The point of all this is that the Ring doesn't induce Overconfidence in you. Overconfidence is when you believe yourself to be more capable than you really are. The Ring doesn't necessarily do that: some of the Ring-induced fantasies that characters have are quite achievable. Maybe Ring-induced fantasies start out as Obsessions (not a Obsession with the Ring, but an Obsession about achieving the fantasy) that can be overridden with a self-control roll, and they only become Megalomania once you've claimed the Ring for yourself. These could be quite dramatic, with the self-control number of the Obsession getting steadily lower and lower, until finally it transforms entirely into uncontrollable Megalomania. I quite like that. |
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05-14-2021, 07:35 PM | #53 | |||
Join Date: Apr 2005
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Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction
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Certainly, however, the Ring had somehow singled him out as the party member most susceptible to influence and was somehow able to play on his fears and weaknesses. Most dominant was his Sense of Duty to Gondor, but Sense of Duty isn't a disadvantage which allows a self-control roll per RAW. (Arguably, it could allow a self-control roll, if you can attempt to ignore your Sense of Duty when it is necessary to do so.) Quote:
Practically, this is exactly the sort of dumbass behavior that player characters might indulge in, either due to good roleplaying or an impulsive player. Quote:
Tolkien never explicitly gives his characters Codes of Honor, but the good guys clearly have a very strong sense of "fair play" at least as it applies to "civilized" (i.e., non-orc) opponents and very strong internal motivations to fight the forces of evil. |
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05-15-2021, 09:50 AM | #54 |
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Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: Southeast NC
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Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction
The Ring twisted Sense of Duty (Gondor) into Obsession (Protect Gondor). Smeagol was already kind of selfish when he found the Ring, so that one was easy. Bilbo and Frodo both possessed the Ring for years before showing much corruption. Sam offers to take the Ring to relieve Frodo's burden for a while, but Frodo refuses, and the Ring can't twist Sense of Duty (Frodo) into anything that would mean betraying Frodo.
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05-15-2021, 01:08 PM | #55 | |
Join Date: Dec 2012
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Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction
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Warning, I have the Distractible and Imaginative quirks in real life. "The more corrupt a government, the more it legislates." -- Tacitus Five Earths, All in a Row. Updated 12/17/2022: Apocrypha: Bridges out of Time, Part I has been posted. |
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05-16-2021, 04:58 AM | #56 |
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Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: Sumter, SC
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Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction
But AIUI Gollem (Sméagol) was a Stoor, one of the three early Hobbit-types and the Ring corrupted him the moment he laid eyes on it causing him to kill the person who had found it.
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05-16-2021, 05:46 AM | #57 |
Join Date: Jan 2005
Location: Gothenburg, Sweden
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Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction
MacBeth fails some kind of self-control roll when he kills Duncan and then later Banquo. Obsession (King of Scotland)? There should be an Ambitious disadvantage, similar to Greed but for power?
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05-16-2021, 06:43 AM | #58 |
Join Date: Apr 2020
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Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction
In the Good Place, Chidi dies of his Indecisive disadvantage because he’s stuck standing under a air conditioning unit while he takes two hours to pick a restaurant. He also has Charitable. Jason throws many an inopportune Molotov cocktail thanks to his Impulsiveness. Tahani pulls a statue on herself and dies of it thanks to her Selfish. Eleanor feels like she has something early on when she’s acting out at Tahani’s party, but I think maybe it’s Odious Personal Habit (Dirtbag) or something like that. She definitely develops Selfless and maybe even Charitable.
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05-16-2021, 07:39 AM | #59 |
Join Date: May 2007
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Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction
By all accounts, the negative traits of Gollum were prefigured in Smeagol (albeit to a lesser degree) even before he found the ring. It seems to be a recurring theme in Tolkein that Evil can't create ex nihilo, but must twist what already exists to its ends.
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05-16-2021, 12:33 PM | #60 |
Join Date: Dec 2012
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Re: Examples of failed self-control rolls in fiction
Also, his friend (also a hobbit) was IIRC far less affected. It seems that Sméagol was an unusually messed up hobbit; so, the exception that tests the rule, not proof that the idea is bad.
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Warning, I have the Distractible and Imaginative quirks in real life. "The more corrupt a government, the more it legislates." -- Tacitus Five Earths, All in a Row. Updated 12/17/2022: Apocrypha: Bridges out of Time, Part I has been posted. |
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