Dodge-able, Irresistible Afflictions

[Adelus]

I'm trying to model afflictions that completely ignore armor (or at least, non-magical DR), but require aim and timing to strike the target and are subject to range penalties.

Malediction doesn't work because it throws in other goodies like having no range limits or chance to dodge. Cosmic: IA seems overpriced if it can still be blocked by Magic Resistance or magical DR - it only works against mundane DR.

Would Cosmic: Irresistible Attack (Accessibility: Only against Mundane Armor, -50%) [+150%] be a reasonable kludge? Its about on-par with Malediction 2 which itself takes the Speed/Range table for range penalties, though it still has the added cost of having to include Increased Range modifiers if you want something better than 10 1/2D and 100 Max. However, it does gain a benefit from abilities like Telescopic Vision for reducing range penalties, something Malediction does not receive, so it might work out.

[PK]

Cosmic, Irresistible attack, is the enhancement for ignoring DR, so you've got it right there. Hit someone with such an Affliction, and they must roll HT at a penalty equal to (Affliction level)-1, without any benefit from DR. Charging half price for "mundane armor only" seems a bit cheap, though -- in most games, mundane armor is far more common than innate DR and magical buffs combined!

Of course, Cosmic, Irresistible attack, is such a poor deal on Affliction that I find it hard to protest too much if you over-cheapen the price in this once instance.

[Adelus]

Yeah; the thing is, I want spells you can dodge, and that take time to reach a target and have a limited range, but ignore DR and take a Quick Contest in the manner of Maledictions.

[Kuroshima]

Originally Posted by Adelus

Yeah; the thing is, I want spells you can dodge, and that take time to reach a target and have a limited range, but ignore DR and take a Quick Contest in the manner of Maledictions.

Have you looked as Weaponized from psionic Powers? it might serve you on the cases where the trait is already malediction-like...

[Adelus]

Originally Posted by Kuroshima

Have you looked as Weaponized from psionic Powers? it might serve you on the cases where the trait is already malediction-like...

I'm not sure it would be legal to take that on Affliction with Malediction or the like... Though it would help in the other cases.

[PK]

Originally Posted by Adelus

Yeah; the thing is, I want spells you can dodge, and that take time to reach a target and have a limited range, but ignore DR and take a Quick Contest in the manner of Maledictions.

Ah, I hadn't realized that specific need.

Okay, so you want them to ignore DR and take a Quick Contest. No problem, that means Malediction is the place to start. You want them to take range penalties, I assume, so Malediction 2 (+150%) models that.

Now, you want it to be dodgeable. So that's a limitation -- since Blockable is -5% and making it parryable is another -5%, it's probably fair to call that a -15% limitation, as a good Dodge is generally seen as being about thrice as useful as a good single Parry or Block. The "takes time to reach a target" is a special effect -- it all happens when you fire it off, after all. Limited range is trickier, but since you're already at -10 to skill at 100 yards, capping range there is worth about -5% in my estimation. (The same -5% would cap range at 10 yards if you had Malediction 1, or at many miles had you Malediction 3.)

So that's a net +130%. Roll skill minus range penalties, and your ability fires off at the target, who may dodge. If he fails to dodge, he must roll a Quick Contest (you use the margin of success on your attack roll; don't roll again) or be affected. DR does not protect.

[Bruno]

EDIT: DOH, this is what I get for sitting with the window open for a while.


Let me check if I have your requirements correct

• Attacker makes a to-hit roll with the usual speed/range penalties, visibility penalties, and whatever.
  • This Attack represents a projectile, and interacts with Cover (note that by default, GURPS attacks don't actually have significant travel time unless they're Guided or Homing)
• If the attack is successful, the Defender makes a Dodge roll
• If there is a successful hit, the Attacker and the Defender engage in a quick contest instead of a Resistance roll by the defender.
• The defenders worn or innate DR does not apply at any point.

A few idle questions not really directed at you so much as at the game mechanics in general, that occurred to me while making that list:
How does the defender benefit from cover if it penetrates all DR?
If cover works, can the defender Block?
What's the dividing line between cover, a shield, and armor anyways?

Back on subject - you're three quarters of the way there with a regular Affliction with Irresistible. Upgrading the regular resistance roll to a quick contest shifts it in your favor - there's nothing really equivalent to this but just poking around...

GURPS Psi Powers has the opposite - taking an attribute roll on YOUR part and turning it into a Quick Contest with the victim (a -10% limitation).

This strongly reminds me of the Short Ranged/Long Ranged modifiers, and suggests that taking the defenders resistance roll and turning it into a Quick Contest is a +50% enhancement.

[DouglasCole]

Originally Posted by Bruno

GURPS Psi Powers has the opposite - taking an attribute roll on YOUR part and turning it into a Quick Contest with the victim (a -10% limitation).

This strongly reminds me of the Short Ranged/Long Ranged modifiers, and suggests that taking the defenders resistance roll and turning it into a Quick Contest is a +50% enhancement.

It's interesting. I did a few hundred thousand sample simulations for skill 4-24 as part of editing my martial arts project, and whether QCs vs attack/defense rolls are an enhancement or not depends on the relative skill levels of the two combatants.

I'd say about 80% of the time, more or less, the QC vs A/D choice made NO DIFFERENCE in the outcome. Outcome was 'attacker wins' vs. 'defender wins,' which obviously neglects margin-of-success based effects, as well as the impact of critical hits (but not the presence/absence of them, which is easy to code into excel).

The remaining 20% of the cases, the Quick Contest was beneficial if the attacker was more skilled by more than a few points than the defender. The Attack/Defense roll was of more benefit when the attacker was LESS skilled than the defender. But again, this is the marginal case; the 80-20 rule suggests that QC vs A/D roll is a 0% choice to first order.

[sir_pudding]

Originally Posted by DouglasCole

The remaining 20% of the cases, the Quick Contest was beneficial if the attacker was more skilled by more than a few points than the defender. The Attack/Defense roll was of more benefit when the attacker was LESS skilled than the defender. But again, this is the marginal case; the 80-20 rule suggests that QC vs A/D roll is a 0% choice to first order.

Isn't the OP talking about having both an Attack/Defense roll and a QC instead of a regular resistance roll?

[Adelus]

Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty

Limited range is trickier, but since you're already at -10 to skill at 100 yards, capping range there is worth about -5% in my estimation. (The same -5% would cap range at 10 yards if you had Malediction 1, or at many miles had you Malediction 3.)

The question of Range here bothers me; how will we handle flexibility of range values?

For instance, if we want to modify range for a longer ranged spell but not on the range of Information/Long-Distance modifiers, can we take the normal Increased/Decreased range modifiers? Is that what the cap above implies as the base being equal to a standard 1/2D 10, Max 100 attack?

I can't honestly see spell effects with a visible, dodge-able aspect taking the Long-Distance modifiers in most instances, so I guess the normal base would be Malediction 2 if such?

Originally Posted by sir_pudding

Isn't the OP talking about having both an Attack/Defense roll and a QC instead of a regular resistance roll?

Yes; you make your roll to attack, your subject gets an active defense, and if the spell does impact, they then take their Resist/Quick Contest roll.