A possible house rule. Does this look balanced to you?

Sam Baughn · 07-15-2006, 06:15 AM

Do you think that it would be reasonable to allow someone to buy enhancements like Armour Divisor and Double Knockback on the Weapon Master advantage, allowing them to gain the benefits of the enhancement whenever they attacked with a suitable weapon? It seems like an easy way to do various cinematic characters, especially super-archers like Legolas in the LotR films.

Gudiomen · 07-15-2006, 07:52 AM

Doesn't look very balanced to me, and can get quite abusive within low point-cost. For +50% you can ignore half the DR on every target you fight against. With +300% you can completely ignore DR and every attack you land will hack bits and pieces off of anything! Even a tank, a monolith or (since there's been a lot of discussion lately) Superman.

One specific attack can be countered, predicted, nullified. But all the range covered by Weapon Master is really much. If you take maximum specialization you'll get to ignore DR with your weapon against anything for just 80 points IIRC. Sounds Super to me... not cinematic.

It's a simple approach though. If all player characters are going to have it (or not fight between themselves) and you don't care to balance with NPC points, I guess it's fine.

I think these characters are represented by the cinematic advantages (straight up) and very high skills. This allows them to get very creative on their attacks, and shrugg off the absurd penalties for doing the things they do. Nothing indicates that Legolas' arrows did more damage, but he could target more vulnerable spots (chinks in armor, vitals, brain, feet) at the same time as he was jumping about. A little generosity with stats and starting points and you're there. You're approach is easier though, I just don't think it's balanced, and it's so absurdly tempting I can't imagine someone not paying the heavy price for it.

Ze'Manel Cunha · 07-15-2006, 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perfect Organism

Do you think that it would be reasonable to allow someone to buy enhancements like Armour Divisor and Double Knockback on the Weapon Master advantage, allowing them to gain the benefits of the enhancement whenever they attacked with a suitable weapon?

Like Gudiomen said, not balanced at all, you get massive power for very low cost.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Perfect Organism

It seems like an easy way to do various cinematic characters, especially super-archers like Legolas in the LotR films.

I'd rather do that with a cinematic 30+ bow skill and then take the penalties for aiming at chinks in armor, etc.

Though I suppose if you really want high RoF arrows you could just let them take:
Innate Attack, 2d6+3 Impaling, Armor Divisor (2), RoF 2, Double Knockback, Extra Range, Trigger (bow&arrows)

Joel · 07-15-2006, 09:01 AM

Seems balanced to me, compared to ST-based innate attacks with the same modifiers, which are generally cheaper for a similar effect.

Or, you could combine ST-based with the trigger (Bow & arrows) option mentioned above (houseruling that ST-based can be used without melee attack, which doesn't seem unbalancing) for something like:

Very Cinematic [possibly super] Archery:

Innate Attack (Impaling Attack thr+1d; Armor Divisor 5, +150%; Increased Range [Max & Half 500 m], +35%; Rapid Fire [RoF 3], +50%; ST-Based, +100%; Trigger [bow & arrows], -10%) [34]

Mehmet · 07-15-2006, 09:24 AM

A very redundant innate (weapon) attack would be

ImpalingAttack 2 pips (Melee Attack, Reach 1, 2, -20%; Armor Divisor (2), +50%; ST Based, +100%) [12]
Cutting Attack 2 pips (Armor Divisor (2), +50%; Melee Attack, Reach 1, 2, -20%; ST Based, +100%) [11/5=3]
Total of 15 points to represent a weapon with THR+2 and SW+2 damage statistics - and that cannot be dropped, stolen, etc.

What the OP proposes would look like;
Weapon Master (All Melee; Armor Divisor (2), +50%) [68];
Weapon Master (One weapon; Armor Divisor (2),+50%) [30].

So, I don't think what the OP proposes is that unbalancing - it is somewhat powerful though.

Cheers...

Fnordianslip · 07-15-2006, 10:26 AM

Sounds powerful, but for a fairly reasonable point campaign, I don't see a problem with it at all. I wouldn't allow it to bypass DR completely, since that wouldn't really go with the genre, but, say a divide by two or three, no problems. With the double knockback, you might actually get to knocking people back a hex when you hit them. Which would be totally cinematically appropriate. Just my two cents.

07-15-2006, 06:15 AM	#1
Sam Baughn Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: United Kingdom of Great Britain and some other bits.	A possible house rule. Does this look balanced to you? Do you think that it would be reasonable to allow someone to buy enhancements like Armour Divisor and Double Knockback on the Weapon Master advantage, allowing them to gain the benefits of the enhancement whenever they attacked with a suitable weapon? It seems like an easy way to do various cinematic characters, especially super-archers like Legolas in the LotR films. __________________ My blog.

07-15-2006, 07:52 AM	#2
Gudiomen Join Date: Feb 2005 Location: in your pocket, stealing all your change	Re: A possible house rule. Does this look balanced to you? Doesn't look very balanced to me, and can get quite abusive within low point-cost. For +50% you can ignore half the DR on every target you fight against. With +300% you can completely ignore DR and every attack you land will hack bits and pieces off of anything! Even a tank, a monolith or (since there's been a lot of discussion lately) Superman. One specific attack can be countered, predicted, nullified. But all the range covered by Weapon Master is really much. If you take maximum specialization you'll get to ignore DR with your weapon against anything for just 80 points IIRC. Sounds Super to me... not cinematic. It's a simple approach though. If all player characters are going to have it (or not fight between themselves) and you don't care to balance with NPC points, I guess it's fine. I think these characters are represented by the cinematic advantages (straight up) and very high skills. This allows them to get very creative on their attacks, and shrugg off the absurd penalties for doing the things they do. Nothing indicates that Legolas' arrows did more damage, but he could target more vulnerable spots (chinks in armor, vitals, brain, feet) at the same time as he was jumping about. A little generosity with stats and starting points and you're there. You're approach is easier though, I just don't think it's balanced, and it's so absurdly tempting I can't imagine someone not paying the heavy price for it.

07-15-2006, 09:01 AM	#4
Joel Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Stockholm, Sweden	Re: A possible house rule. Does this look balanced to you? Seems balanced to me, compared to ST-based innate attacks with the same modifiers, which are generally cheaper for a similar effect. Or, you could combine ST-based with the trigger (Bow & arrows) option mentioned above (houseruling that ST-based can be used without melee attack, which doesn't seem unbalancing) for something like: Very Cinematic [possibly super] Archery: Innate Attack (Impaling Attack thr+1d; Armor Divisor 5, +150%; Increased Range [Max & Half 500 m], +35%; Rapid Fire [RoF 3], +50%; ST-Based, +100%; Trigger [bow & arrows], -10%) [34] Last edited by Joel; 07-15-2006 at 09:26 AM.

07-15-2006, 09:24 AM	#5
Mehmet MIB Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Hemel Hempstead, Hertfordshire	Re: A possible house rule. Does this look balanced to you? A very redundant innate (weapon) attack would be ImpalingAttack 2 pips (Melee Attack, Reach 1, 2, -20%; Armor Divisor (2), +50%; ST Based, +100%) [12] Cutting Attack 2 pips (Armor Divisor (2), +50%; Melee Attack, Reach 1, 2, -20%; ST Based, +100%) [11/5=3] Total of 15 points to represent a weapon with THR+2 and SW+2 damage statistics - and that cannot be dropped, stolen, etc. What the OP proposes would look like; Weapon Master (All Melee; Armor Divisor (2), +50%) [68]; Weapon Master (One weapon; Armor Divisor (2),+50%) [30]. So, I don't think what the OP proposes is that unbalancing - it is somewhat powerful though. Cheers... __________________ My wife's music site, LadyObscure is for the prog/metal heads...

07-15-2006, 10:26 AM	#6
Fnordianslip Join Date: Dec 2005	Re: A possible house rule. Does this look balanced to you? Sounds powerful, but for a fairly reasonable point campaign, I don't see a problem with it at all. I wouldn't allow it to bypass DR completely, since that wouldn't really go with the genre, but, say a divide by two or three, no problems. With the double knockback, you might actually get to knocking people back a hex when you hit them. Which would be totally cinematically appropriate. Just my two cents.