Nauseating appearance

[hal]

I'm trying to stat out some special abilities for a demon that can be summoned. The special ability can only affect its victim once per engagement. It is resisted by the victim's Will, and only affects those who can see the demon closely (ie within 6 feet). If the victim fails their will roll, it will inflict a -2 penalty to all attributes, and -1 to active defenses.

At this point, I think the build is something like this:

Affliction I: 10 Pts per level
Area Affect: +50%
Emanation: -20%
Irritant: Nauseating: +30
Resistable (Will): -30%

Net Cost: 13

If I've built this right using the example from Powers and the rules from Characters, this ability should only affect a person once they come into range of 6', roll against their Will once. If they succeed, this ability will not affect the person who made their will saving roll. If they fail their will, then they will suffer a -2 to all skills and attributes for a duration equal to 1 minute per point they failed by. If the victim should step out of range, and then back into range, they don't have to make another will saving roll - because this only affects them once per encounter.

Now, later on, say, 2 weeks later, they run into the same demon, they still have to roll against their Will the first time they are within 2 hexes of the demon, correct?

[vierasmarius]

One problem I see here. You have Resisted By Will as a -30% limitation, by Afflictions are already resistable by HT. As written, the subject would roll both HT and Will, resisting the effect if either is successful. If you want them to resist with Will instead of with HT, that's Based on Will +20% (B102).

Other than that, it appears kosher. You may also be able to build a trait like this with a modified Terror. I seem to recall tables in GURPS Horror giving alternate Fright Check results, suitable for Madness or Awe. There probably isn't one for Disgust, but some of the same effects (mental stun, vomiting, fatigue loss) could be appropriate.

[Christopher R. Rice]

If I were you I'd build this a bit differently. You basically want the sight of the thing to make the beholder sick, right? I'd do it as:

Affliction 1 (HT or Will; Always On, -40%; Based on HT or Will, +40%; Increased Immunity 3, -30%; Malediction 1, +100%; Nauseating, +30%; Vision-Based, -20%) [18/level]

Now anyone that sees the creature will need to make a roll against the lower of their HT or Will against the demon's Will, failure results in being Nauseated for minutes equal to their margin of failure. Success means the target is immune to the demon's appearance for 24 hours.

[hal]

For what it is worth, I appreciate it when people point out what I'm missing, because frankly, this whole thing gets me "confused". For instance, much of what I used to build this "power" was based upon POWERS page 39 under "fields". The idea was to build an affliction that only affected people it came within close contact with (6 feet area effect centered on the demon itself). That it is vision based is that a blind man would not see it and not be affected.

Having two attributes to roll against, taking the lower of the two seems to contradict what was stated in the other post where the victim gets two resistance rolls.

So - that alone has me confused big time :(

If I can't handle the relatively simple "nauseating appearance" for this minor demon, how in the nine hells am I going to construct the "plague bite"?

Why for example, does the example for area effect afflictions lack the "malediction" modifier, yet Ghostdancer's does? It seems from my read of the rules, that area affect afflictions are automatic effects, but only if a person comes within a given radius from the source of the affliction - as opposed to having to cast it like a spell at -1 penalty per hex from the caster, or as an area effect that can be lobbed at will instead of being centered on the owner of the afflicting ability.

*sigh*

I've been reading, re-reading, cross referencing between GURPS CHARACTERS and GURPS POWERS and ending up more confused :( Maybe some sleep will help...

Sorry guys.

[vierasmarius]

Originally Posted by hal

Having two attributes to roll against, taking the lower of the two seems to contradict what was stated in the other post where the victim gets two resistance rolls.

So - that alone has me confused big time :(

As you'd originally written, the Resistable by Will (-30%) limitation adds an extra resistance roll to the ability. That's why it would allow both an HT and Will roll, with success on either negating it. I suggested Based on Will (+20%), an enhancement that lets you specify a single different attribute for the power to be resisted by. In Ghostdancer's build, he used Based on Will or HT (+40%), another enhancement (though I'm not sure of where it's located in the books) which lets the user choose which of the victim's attributes to target each time he uses the power.

Why for example, does the example for area effect afflictions lack the "malediction" modifier, yet Ghostdancer's does? It seems from my read of the rules, that area affect afflictions are automatic effects, but only if a person comes within a given radius from the source of the affliction - as opposed to having to cast it like a spell at -1 penalty per hex from the caster, or as an area effect that can be lobbed at will instead of being centered on the owner of the afflicting ability.

Malediction makes it so the power uses a Quick Contest of the user's Will vs the victim's HT or Will (because of the enhancement mentioned above). Without Malediction, the target would get a simple HT or Will roll to resist (penalized by Affliction level-1).

I've been reading, re-reading, cross referencing between GURPS CHARACTERS and GURPS POWERS and ending up more confused :( Maybe some sleep will help...

Sorry guys.

Well, I hope we were some help at least. I'll probably be around tomorrow too if you want to take another crack at it.

[WingedKagouti]

Originally Posted by hal

If I can't handle the relatively simple "nauseating appearance" for this minor demon, how in the nine hells am I going to construct the "plague bite"?

The main thing you should remember is: Points are for PCs only.

Unless this ability is going to be available to PCs to buy or you need to know the point value of something for other purposes, you should not bother actually statting it out with points (unless you absolutely want to), but just note the effect and how it works. That means any rolls to use and any damage and/or side effects.

Yes, GURPS is flexible enough to stat out almost any kind of character and ability. That doesn't mean it's necessary to do so for NPCs or their abilities.

If you need to know whether they can summon a specific demon so they can question it, just do what's needed for drama and suspense.

[hal]

Originally Posted by WingedKagouti

The main thing you should remember is: Points are for PCs only.

Unless this ability is going to be available to PCs to buy or you need to know the point value of something for other purposes, you should not bother actually statting it out with points (unless you absolutely want to), but just note the effect and how it works. That means any rolls to use and any damage and/or side effects.

Yes, GURPS is flexible enough to stat out almost any kind of character and ability. That doesn't mean it's necessary to do so for NPCs or their abilities.

If you need to know whether they can summon a specific demon so they can question it, just do what's needed for drama and suspense.

I agree with the sentiment you've expressed above, but you also hit it on the head with respect to why I need to stat it out. GURPS MAGIC determines the cost of summoning a demon by its point value. *rueful grin*

[Gold & Appel Inc]

Originally Posted by hal

I agree with the sentiment you've expressed above, but you also hit it on the head with respect to why I need to stat it out. GURPS MAGIC determines the cost of summoning a demon by its point value. *rueful grin*

All that aside, I enjoy it for its own sake, but I recognize that not everybody does. The, "Don't Stat Where It's Inconvenient," crowd and the, "But I Enjoy Statting Stuff! What if I have to use it for a PC three years from now or some crap!?" crowd don't have to be mutually-exclusive.

[Genesis]

Originally Posted by hal

I agree with the sentiment you've expressed above, but you also hit it on the head with respect to why I need to stat it out. GURPS MAGIC determines the cost of summoning a demon by its point value. *rueful grin*

That may be so, but if you're the GM you should feel free to estimate that value. Play "Name That Tune" with yourself: "I can stat that power in.... twenty points!" Fine, just call it 20 and move on. If, as in Ghostdancer's build, it actually comes out to 18 - well, whatever. You're the GM. If statting out random powers for minor demons isn't doing it for you, wave you hands behind your screen and the players won't know the difference. On the other hand, maybe you think it's good practice to write it up - but it's only worth doing if it makes the game better/more enjoyable for you. Gaming shouldn't be punishment.

[WingedKagouti]

Originally Posted by Gold & Appel Inc

All that aside, I enjoy it for its own sake, but I recognize that not everybody does. The, "Don't Stat Where It's Inconvenient," crowd and the, "But I Enjoy Statting Stuff! What if I have to use it for a PC three years from now or some crap!?" crowd don't have to be mutually-exclusive.

I love messing with values and tweaking stuff to make it just right, but there's also a thing called "too much work".

Originally Posted by Genesis

That may be so, but if you're the GM you should feel free to estimate that value. Play "Name That Tune" with yourself: "I can stat that power in.... twenty points!" Fine, just call it 20 and move on. If, as in Ghostdancer's build, it actually comes out to 18 - well, whatever. You're the GM.

That would be my approach for any truly tricky non-PC abilities that need a point value for some reason.