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Old 10-14-2021, 10:45 PM   #21
Balor Patch
 
Join Date: Apr 2013
Default Re: How is Steal Skill supposed to work?

The caster has to secure the target for 1 minute (perhaps by using the Daze spell) and, as is normally done, Concentrate during that time to cast the spell. The target resists when the spell is cast. The advantage compared to Borrow Skill is that the target doesn't need to be willing, just secured.
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Old 10-15-2021, 01:50 AM   #22
David Johnston2
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Default Re: How is Steal Skill supposed to work?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Balor Patch View Post
The caster has to secure the target for 1 minute (perhaps by using the Daze spell) and, as is normally done, Concentrate during that time to cast the spell. The target resists when the spell is cast. The advantage compared to Borrow Skill is that the target doesn't need to be willing, just secured.
Just immobile. You could cast it on a sleeping person or anyone else who doesn't move for a solid minute.
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Old 10-15-2021, 03:16 AM   #23
Taneli
 
Join Date: Aug 2004
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Default Re: How is Steal Skill supposed to work?

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Originally Posted by David Johnston2 View Post
Just immobile. You could cast it on a sleeping person or anyone else who doesn't move for a solid minute.
Imagine casting it on a sleeping subject, who just happens to toss around at 59th second? :D
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Old 10-15-2021, 08:11 AM   #24
Dalin
 
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Default Re: How is Steal Skill supposed to work?

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Originally Posted by Taneli View Post
Imagine casting it on a sleeping subject, who just happens to toss around at 59th second? :D
See GURPS Sleep, with tables to account for tossing and turning, REM sleep, and pillowcase drool, among many others! ;)
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Old 10-15-2021, 12:39 PM   #25
Dalillama
 
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Default Re: How is Steal Skill supposed to work?

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Originally Posted by David Johnston2 View Post
Just immobile. You could cast it on a sleeping person or anyone else who doesn't move for a solid minute.
Picturing a song mage who immobilizes victims by asking them to listen to a new song they composed...
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Old 10-17-2021, 08:39 AM   #26
Donny Brook
 
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Default Re: How is Steal Skill supposed to work?

The text says "neither character can do anything for that duration." [Emphasis added]

So it is insufficient to merely physically restrain the victim since a restrained person is still able to Concentrate, Evaluate, speak, and attempt to Break Free.
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Old 10-17-2021, 09:45 AM   #27
Fred Brackin
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Default Re: How is Steal Skill supposed to work?

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Originally Posted by Donny Brook View Post
The text says "neither character can do anything for that duration." [Emphasis added]

So it is insufficient to merely physically restrain the victim since a restrained person is still able to Concentrate, Evaluate, speak, and attempt to Break Free.
As bad as the initial write up might have been you are retro-projecting 4e-isms onto 3e rules text to make it even worse. Of your options only Break free would count and only if successful.

Yes, "Target must be unconscious or physically restrained" would have been clearer but that doesn't mean you can't rule it that way now. There are no prizes for the most convoluted rules interpretation.
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Old 10-17-2021, 09:55 AM   #28
Donny Brook
 
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Default Re: How is Steal Skill supposed to work?

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Originally Posted by Fred Brackin View Post
As bad as the initial write up might have been you are retro-projecting 4e-isms onto 3e rules text to make it even worse. Of your options only Break free would count and only if successful.
The OP quotes Magic 4e. Concentrate and Evaluate are both Manouevers so they are clearly doing something (in particular, something different than a Do Nothing Manouever). The text doesn't even confine itself to Manouevers, giving a more general prohibition: "anything". Speaking is a Free Action (so not nothing).


Quote:
Yes, "Target must be unconscious or physically restrained" would have been clearer
But it may not be what was intended. The example really doesn't seem to contemplate such a condition.


Quote:
...that doesn't mean you can't rule it that way now. There are no prizes for the most convoluted rules interpretation.
Indeed. Any GM encountering this spell is not only allowed to make an interpretation, but compelled to. With text as unusable as this spell offers, aesthetics is probably the best guide.

EDIT: Personally, I think the simplest interpretation would be to say that the mage must maintain contact for the full minute That would be clearer language, and could be achieved by subterfuge, coercion, restraint, consent, or whatever.

Last edited by Donny Brook; 10-17-2021 at 10:08 AM.
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Old 10-17-2021, 09:56 AM   #29
JulianLW
 
Join Date: Apr 2019
Default Re: How is Steal Skill supposed to work?

Again, here's my replacement spell. I had to correct the duration after rereading the description of "Costs Fatigue;" I thought it might be off.

Mimic Skill (Spell, IQ/VH): Information; Resisted by Will.

This spell adapts an advantage (a modified version of "Borrow Skill" from Psionic Powers) to a skill in a manner similar to Kromm’s “From Skills to Advantages” from Pyramid 3/44.

“You can reach out and tap into the knowledge of the people around you, temporarily gaining a skill, [spell,] or language. Roll against your … skill to find the range of this [spell]. If successful, consult the Long-Distance Modifiers chart (B241), reading your margin of success (as a negative number) on the Penalty column. If anyone within range has this skill (GM’s call), you gain it temporarily ….” This takes 2 seconds for each point gained, up to 4 points. “If you are in direct mental contact with a person … range as negligible. The ‘donor’ does not lose the skill. [H]e may choose to resist” this spell (Psionic Powers 57).

Duration: 1 minute, or until the donor is out of range; counts as a spell on until ended. See Psionic Powers 57-58 for further details.

Cost: 5 to cast, 3 to maintain.

Time to cast: 2 seconds for each point of skill or ability gained, up to 4 points total.

Prerequisites: Magery, Secret Spell: Mimic Skill.

Statistics: Telepathic Learning 4 (Psionic Powers 16), Costs 5 FP -25%, Requires IQ Roll, Resistible -20%, Takes Extra Time -10%, Magic -10%, Feature: long-distance modifiers instead of fixed range, 8 points.

This ability is comparable to a Very Hard skill at Attribute level; the Very Hard spell replaces the ability and otherwise functions exactly as a spell, with cost and time-to-cast reductions for high skill, etc.

Last edited by JulianLW; 10-17-2021 at 09:59 AM.
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Old 10-17-2021, 10:04 AM   #30
Fred Brackin
 
Join Date: Aug 2007
Default Re: How is Steal Skill supposed to work?

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Originally Posted by Donny Brook View Post
The OP quotes Magic 4e. e.
<shrug> It may be in a 4e book but it was written for 3e and was not re-written de novo for 4e. I suppose that's the root of most complaints about the book.
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