Official Rules Update and FAQ (Draft versions 1.01 - June 21)

[hcobb]

SHVY overruns non-disabled SHVY. Defender plinks off some other overruning units with gunfire, then rams the attacker.

By 8.05.3 this gets punted back to 6.07.1 The defending SHVY suffers a 1-1 attack, possibly disabling it, and the attacking SHVY is destroyed.

Right?

[Mack_JB]

While there are numerous accounts (mainly from WW2 on the Eastern Front) of tank on tank ramming action; why so many rules and questions in Ogre?

If you ram anything your own size or larger, you are disabled for the full game or destroyed completely, as is your opponent. Ramming anything smaller than you should be seen as ramming guns and trucks, not armor. For all the documented rams in history, there are very few where the ramming vehicle gets away clean.

Needless convolutions that cannot be supported by historical research.

[Mack_JB]

To further clarify (based on the artwork seen in Ogre to date):

Ogres ram because of their huge size and very impressive ground clearance, they are literally driving up on top of, and over opposing armor, crushing it, and lose treads for doing so -- they should lose more than the rules allow, but that's the game structure (think of every movie you can remember where a tank runs over a car in the street, or that incident in San Diego a few decades ago where a tank was stolen and careened wildly through the streets).

Everything else in Ogre has little to almost no ground clearance, and is ramming at the same level -- mainly direct impact damage (think car crashes here). Intentional tank to tank ramming to do damage will leave no one unscathed, and neither side wins, it's a desperation move.

[dwalend]

Originally Posted by hcobb

SHVY overruns non-disabled SHVY. Defender plinks off some other overruning units with gunfire, then rams the attacker.

By 8.05.3 this gets punted back to 6.07.1 The defending SHVY suffers a 1-1 attack, possibly disabling it, and the attacking SHVY is destroyed.

Right?

That's my reading of it. SHVYs are dangerous.

Should Ds be Xs, as Kevin suggests? That'd be a big difference between section 6 and section 8 rules.

[hcobb]

D to X seems confined to 8.04 while 8.05.3 calls for "normal effects".

[GranitePenguin]

The rules updates:
4.02 Phases of a turn (p. 10)

• Step 1(b) should say “On a roll of 3 to 6, the unit recovers . . .” instead of “1 to 4”
• Step 3 should say “. . . to check whether it is stuck or disabled.”

Should also be applied to the Reference Sheet (only step 5 is currently listed).

Additionally, step 2(a) should be changed to refer to rolling for stuck (both in the rules and the Reference Sheet).

However, the current wording:

Disable check. Roll for each armor unit which entered swamp or rubble, and each GEV which entered swamp/rubble/forest, to check whether it is disabled. Units which rolled for disabling in step 2 do not roll again.

May not actually need to be changed (at least, not the way it's currently proposed). The problem is it may not make sense to lump "stuck" together with "disabled." The proposed change would imply ALL units have the potential to be stuck or disabled when, in fact, only heavy tracked units can become stuck (and NOT disabled).


The terrain effects table for INF should be changed to "Same as Swamp" for Forest and Rubble to make wording consistent. This doesn't change anything, just something to be noted in the event of a Rules reprint.

[GranitePenguin]

Another FAQ item regarding GEV and INF Road bonuses...

There are two types of hex with both road and railroad; parallel and crossing.

If a GEV or INF is on a road and they come to a hex that also has a railroad, can they transition from road to railroad and retain the road bonus?

[dwalend]

Originally Posted by GranitePenguin

There are two types of hex with both road and railroad; parallel and crossing.

If a GEV or INF is on a road and they come to a hex that also has a railroad, can they transition from road to railroad and retain the road bonus?

For INF, definitely yes.

For GEV, yes for Ogre KISS.

[wolf90]

Originally Posted by GranitePenguin

Another FAQ item regarding GEV and INF Road bonuses...

There are two types of hex with both road and railroad; parallel and crossing.

If a GEV or INF is on a road and they come to a hex that also has a railroad, can they transition from road to railroad and retain the road bonus?

Originally Posted by dwalend

For INF, definitely yes.

For GEV, yes for Ogre KISS.

I agree.

And although I think KISS is more than enough to allow the GEV bonus, if you think about rail and road junctions, they are smooth with an easy transition from one to the other, so I think it is reasonable in a "real world" sense as well.

D.

[GranitePenguin]

That's how I see it as well (and have been playing it). I'm putting it out here so it's documented.

The crossings are an easy sell, but the parallel situation is a little less obvious. KISS would have them be the same to make the rule easy.