Splitting the DX attribute…

[briansommers]

I love what Harnmaster does by having Dexterity and Agility as separate attributes.

Cleaning/reassembling your gun DX

walking across a narrow beam or dancing is AG

Has anyone else done this?
Thoughts/ideas?

[chihuahuazero]

You should take a look at GURPS Power-Ups 9: Alternate Attributes. It not only has a section on dividing up DX into multiple attributes but also has an example of an Agility skill list.

For how it works in practice, I'm curious to hear too.

[Kesendeja]

Originally Posted by briansommers

I love what Harnmaster does by having Dexterity and Agility as separate attributes.

Cleaning/reassembling your gun DX

walking across a narrow beam or dancing is AG

Has anyone else done this?
Thoughts/ideas?

I think the biggest problem would be splitting the skills and abilities. Then you'd have to adjust both the point cost for the new attributes, and the CP given to build characters.

Knowing how much work it would end up being has kept me from trying to implement a change like that. Would I like too, yes, would my players rise up in rebellion, also a yes.

Also, depending on the game, it may not fit. For a highly cinematic game it's probably best to not bother. On the other hand a highly detailed game where nuance, and niche protection, is important would fare better with it.

[Inky]

GURPS seems to do this, using the High Manual Dexterity advantage (5 points per level, not 10, possibly because it's almost always the other kind of DX - what Harnmaster would call Agility - that's used in combat, making it more valuable than Manual Dexterity). Apparently it's not symmetrical, though - to have Manual Dexterity lower than your large-scale DX, you'd have to use the Ham-Fisted disadvantage, which is -5 points for -3 to DX or -10 points for -6 to DX.

[transmetahuman]

Originally Posted by Kesendeja

I think the biggest problem would be splitting the skills and abilities.

I would just float all the skills to whichever stat seemed appropriate to whatever it's currently being used to attempt. There's only one secondary characteristic derived from DX, and it's clearly more of an Agility thing than a (manual) Dexterity thing.

GURPS skills can float from IQ to Per, or DX to IQ; there no meaningful distinction between IQ and DX skills anymore besides "it'll probably be based on this stat most often".

[kirbwarrior]

I haven't mostly because a combination of Talents, Bang skills, High Manual Dexterity, and other traits have made it largely unnecessary for me.

The biggest problem of course is making the attributes the exact right cost. There's hundreds of skills spread across basically 40pts of attributes; DX minus Basic Speed, IQ, HT minus Basic Speed and Fatigue. If you split DX, where does Basic Speed go? Do each of Agility and (new) Dexterity cost 10pts each, making it a steal for the physical skills you want to focus on? Do they cost more and require overall point totals to increase?

Of course, I don't know why I'm asking these questions, PU9 is explicitly the book with the answers XD

[David L Pulver]

Originally Posted by briansommers

I love what Harnmaster does by having Dexterity and Agility as separate attributes.

Cleaning/reassembling your gun DX

walking across a narrow beam or dancing is AG

Has anyone else done this?
Thoughts/ideas?

I've considered it, though common things like "attacking with a sword" are logically a combination of both agility, coordination, and physical power.

I'd actually suggest replacing most of the "requires careful coordination" abilities with CONCENTRATION (CO) or DILIGENCE (DI) which is that aspect of intelligence, perception, and coordination that covers being able to focus and concentrate under stress. This could then cover ranged combat (for bows, etc. you also need enough ST to use it) and cleaning a gun and watchmaking and mechanic skills and many other things other IQ and DX.


Then you would rename DX, as Reflexes (RX) and use that for all things requiring speed, quickness, and agility , and balance - not missile attacks, but including melee weapons, dancing, and many but not all of the DX-based abilities.