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Old 01-22-2016, 08:18 PM   #31
Flyndaran
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Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

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Originally Posted by VariousRen View Post
It goes beyond being tricked, you physically can't be forced, which removes a potential entry point for poisons or other hazards. Sounds like a Perk to me.
If you want to injure someone that you already have at your mercy, who cares if you have one fewer vector to use?

Poisons can be inhaled, injected, topical, etc.
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Old 01-22-2016, 09:06 PM   #32
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Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

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I still don't see why it would be a zero point feature. It removes character choice and that's always a disadvantage in every other situation.
Not really. Doesn't Breath doesn't get a discount because you can't voluntarily drown yourself either. And it's difficult to make a very convincing case it should.

Not being able to eat when you don't need to is perhaps slightly more inconvenient than not being able to voluntarily drown, but still quite plausibly a zero point special effect either way.
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Old 01-22-2016, 09:19 PM   #33
Flyndaran
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Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

Not being able to appear to inhale is not the same as not being able to willfully kill yourself via drowning.
That's a really bad example for someone like you.

I understand that it's very close to the quirk level, at most, that can easily be swamped by other Unnatural Features likely to matter more in game.
But I just hate the "it's all too much hassle, so I'll pretend everything cancels out to avoid pricing things" mentality everyone seems to imply in this thread.

That way led to the mess up that was Gurps WoD books. Modularity is what I love most about Gurps.

I think I at least understand why most here would "feature it out". So I'm good now.
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Old 01-22-2016, 09:41 PM   #34
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Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

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Not being able to appear to inhale is not the same as not being able to willfully kill yourself via drowning.
That's a really bad example for someone like you.

I understand that it's very close to the quirk level, at most, that can easily be swamped by other Unnatural Features likely to matter more in game.
But I just hate the "it's all too much hassle, so I'll pretend everything cancels out to avoid pricing things" mentality everyone seems to imply in this thread.

That way led to the mess up that was Gurps WoD books. Modularity is what I love most about Gurps.
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Old 01-22-2016, 11:05 PM   #35
simply Nathan
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Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

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But I just hate the "it's all too much hassle, so I'll pretend everything cancels out to avoid pricing things" mentality everyone seems to imply in this thread.
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Old 01-23-2016, 12:40 AM   #36
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Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

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Painfully true. Though many features of Size aren't used in most gaming styles.
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Old 01-23-2016, 05:20 AM   #37
Peter Knutsen
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Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

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As Kromm stated that lack of choice is balanced against you can't be tricked into swallowing a tracker or some other baleful effect.
I don't think that balances anything much. It's a fairly obscure situation.
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Old 01-23-2016, 08:14 AM   #38
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Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

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Not being able to appear to inhale is not the same as not being able to willfully kill yourself via drowning.
That's a really bad example for someone like you.
Well it doesn't give you a discount for not being able to inhale either.

I think the core issue here is actually the same as for Supernatural Feature, which I've always thought are fundamentally incorrectly priced. The "disadvantage" of an supernatural feature isn't the feature - if you are a wheeled robot, you don't get to take No Body Heat even if you don't have any. What they really are is an undefined Social Stigma with an otherwise disallowed limitation (people may not notice), with how obvious they are making the limitation smaller, or alternately a limitation on your Passing Appearance perk you aren't being charged for, and which since that's otherwise considered a perk shouldn't allow more than -1 point for cancelling it altogether if you were.

It's just not an area the GURPS rules are all that well thought out, probably in part because it is so setting dependent. If nobody *cares* if you are human having features that mark you as an alien or not shouldn't be worth any points one way or the other.
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Old 01-23-2016, 09:14 AM   #39
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Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

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It's just not an area the GURPS rules are all that well thought out, probably in part because it is so setting dependent. If nobody *cares* if you are human having features that mark you as an alien or not shouldn't be worth any points one way or the other.
I generally agree that the way its written isn't really right. At the very least the Supernatural Feature writeup needs an extra paragraph to explain that it requires the Secret: Is a $fnu disadvantage, and is completely forbidden if you aren't masquerading as anything.

Perhaps it's better written as an enhancement to Secret - you have "tells" that aren't directly related to Frequency of Appearance that can still give you away.
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Old 01-23-2016, 09:29 AM   #40
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Default Re: Does Doesn't Eat or Drink include can't Eat or Drink?

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I generally agree that the way its written isn't really right. At the very least the Supernatural Feature writeup needs an extra paragraph to explain that it requires the Secret: Is a $fnu disadvantage, and is completely forbidden if you aren't masquerading as anything.

Perhaps it's better written as an enhancement to Secret - you have "tells" that aren't directly related to Frequency of Appearance that can still give you away.
There's the intermediate case where it is predictable that at some point you probably will want to try masquerading at something (specifically, you will most likely end up in a situation where you'll want to "pass"), even if it isn't a part of your routine life, or your routine adventuring modus operandum.

And then there's rarity, making your supernature Feature also be a Distinctive Feature. If you're the only "Human" in medieval Rome whose eyes reflect light like a cat's, then there are a fairly large amount of escapades that you'll have a much harder time getting away with, compared to if light-reflecting eyes were fairly comon or to if your eyes didn't do that.
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