Do SJG mind people distributing GURPS Lite?

[Inky]

GURPS Lite is free and seems to be supposed to be a sort of free sample, but it still seems to only be available through Warehouse 23. Do SJG mind people distributing the GURPS Lite PDF themselves, say from other websites? Would that still be considered "piracy" even though it's a free product?

Some people in the "GURPS News updated" thread suggested that making ready-made adventures or even series of adventures that were compatible with GURPS Lite and bundling them with GURPS Lite as a "GURPS test drive" might be a useful way to advertise GURPS. This might or might not happen, but SJG always seems to be short of enough writers and editors to write as much new material as they'd like to. It occurred to me that if people who aren't SJG can distribute copies of GURPS Lite themselves, then players could have a shot at making and distributing such a thing themselves if they wanted to.

[Anthony]

There's a statement on page 1 of GURPS Lite specifying how it can be distributed.

[Inky]

Looked at GURPS Lite and answered my own question. Sorry about the time-wasting.

Originally Posted by From the small print at the bottom of page 1 of Gurps Lite

GURPS Lite is copyright © 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2003, 2004 by Steve Jackson Games Incorporated. It is intended for free distribution. You are encouraged to copy and share these 32 pages freely. You may not charge for it, except to cover the actual cost of copying. You may not remove any part of it. You may not change or modify it, except that retailers, distributors or conventions may add “Courtesy of (name)” at the top of this page. You absolutely may not incorporate this game, or parts of it, into another product for distribution in any way. GURPS Lite is available in PDF format from www.sjgames.com/gurps/lite/. You may distribute this PDF file freely under the above restrictions, and post copies of it online. You may not sell it or include it as part of any product for sale without the written permission of Steve Jackson Games Incorporated.

So it sounds like bundling it with an adventure in a single PDF file, whether the PDF file was free or paid-for, is disapproved of but putting a link to a direct download of the unaltered GURPS Lite PDF right next to the download link for a GURPS Lite-compatible adventure wouldn't be. Might be close enough. Possibly throw in a blank character sheet PDF too, to get round that awkward thing of GURPS Lite having a half-size character sheet which you have to work out how to print at double size.

Seems odd that SJG don't provide a direct link for GURPS Lite themselves, it seems like if you have a free trial it makes sense to make it easy to try it without having to register a Warehouse 23 account, but that's up to them.

[Inky]

Oops, crossed in the post, sorry Anthony :-D

[thrash]

Originally Posted by Inky

... putting a link to a direct download of the unaltered GURPS Lite PDF right next to the download link for a GURPS Lite-compatible adventure wouldn't be.

Note that you should probably check out the SJ Games Online Policy, if you haven't already done so, before posting something that touches on their intellectual property.

[Vikingv]

GURPS Lite can also be obtained on another website (for free) that is known to sell all kinds of RP materials.

[Plane]

Originally Posted by Vikingv

GURPS Lite can also be obtained on another website (for free) that is known to sell all kinds of RP materials.

SJG also still gives both versions out for free

http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/lite/3e/gurpslite.pdf

http://www.warehouse23.com/products/SJG31-0004

It's a nice blend since the 3e had some magic which the 4e version didn't have room for.

Plus there's also http://www.warehouse23.com/products/gurps-ultra-lite

[tbone]

Originally Posted by Plane

It's a nice blend since the 3e had some magic which the 4e version didn't have room for.

It's interesting to note that LITE for 3e had quite a bit not found in 4e. Which is not to dump on the latter; I think it improves on appearance and readability, and probably adds to 3e in areas I haven't noticed. But it's interesting to note the many extras that 3e had. To copy/paste from my own article on LITE:

No one wants to be compared to the older sibling who did things better. But before brushing off too many suggestions for a revamped LITE with “there’s just no space”, let’s take a look back at what LITE for 3e (October 2001 Edition) accomplished. Along with the same basics found in LITE for 4e, it offers:

• More weapons – two full pages of tables! (With javelin! Smallsword and saber! Twice as many bows, plus a prodd! Two flails instead of none! Three polearms and three knives, not one of each! Sling skill and weapons! Baton and light club! Two-handed axe and maul! More pistols, more rifles, and beam weapons! And even rock!)
• A bigger character form
• A full-page sample character (though, yes, it’s ol’ Dai again…)
• Basics on non-humans and animals
• Stats for 11 riding and draft animals (vs 0 in LITE for 4e)
• A Tech Level table! (Edit: Actually, LITE for 4e has a brief one too; it’s tucked into the discussion of Starting Wealth on p18.)
• A short section on jobs
• THE GURPS MAGIC SYSTEM! Sure, it’s short, and leaves key questions untouched (like what’s the range for spells). But you get the core basics plus 14 spells in one and a half pages. (This is a nice tribute to the simplicity of GURPS‘ default magic system.)

LITE for 3e manages all that in the same 32 pages as LITE for 4e. I’m not quite sure how it achieves this miracle. Some cramped layout at the expense of appearance, perhaps, but overall I’m impressed.

Okay, that's getting off-topic from the OP question about distributing LITE. But I offer it as support for your suggestion that the 3e version may be worth nabbing too (if users don't mind upgrading content as needed).

[Inky]

Originally Posted by thrash

Note that you should probably check out the SJ Games Online Policy, if you haven't already done so, before posting something that touches on their intellectual property.

Interesting. It doesn't actually say anything about GURPS Lite being an exception to what it says about not copying things; presumably what GURPS Lite itself says about them not minding copying it in specific ways is meant to overrule that.

But it looks as if there might actually be a problem with adventures. It makes it sound as if they're saying you're not allowed to sell GURPS adventures, unless you're specially licensed, even if you don't quote the rulebooks in them. Is that the case? If so, that's awkward - I was thinking that people might be more likely to write such a "GURPS trial run" adventure if they could charge a few quid for it. Still, people do publish GURPS adventures for free, so they might for this!

Originally Posted by Vikingv

GURPS Lite can also be obtained on another website (for free) that is known to sell all kinds of RP materials.

Oh, DriveThruRPG does have it (guessed you meant that). I'd forgotten that, if I knew before. That's probably useful, gets it out there that little bit more.

Originally Posted by Plane

SJG also still gives both versions out for free

http://www.sjgames.com/gurps/lite/3e/gurpslite.pdf

http://www.warehouse23.com/products/SJG31-0004

It's a nice blend since the 3e had some magic which the 4e version didn't have room for.

Plus there's also http://www.warehouse23.com/products/gurps-ultra-lite

What I meant was that although GURPS Lite (and GURPS Ultra-Lite) are available for free on Warehouse 23, new players still have to register a Warehouse 23 account to get them, which is an extra hoop to jump through. Odd that GURPS Lite 3e is available as a direct download from sjgames.com and GURPS Lite 4e apparently isn't!

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Inky

Interesting. It doesn't actually say anything about GURPS Lite being an exception to what it says about not copying things; presumably what GURPS Lite itself says about them not minding copying it in specific ways is meant to overrule that.

It does, though the fact that you can't reformat it means you can't do things like put together a html version.

Originally Posted by Inky

But it looks as if there might actually be a problem with adventures. It makes it sound as if they're saying you're not allowed to sell GURPS adventures, unless you're specially licensed, even if you don't quote the rulebooks in them. Is that the case?

Yes. SJG has never embraced anything equivalent to OGL.