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Old 01-20-2014, 10:17 PM   #171
jeff_wilson
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Default Re: Ziusudra / Nyx questions

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Originally Posted by sir_pudding View Post
The actual childhood experiences of a typical 4th or 5th wave human child. .....You say it's a normal childhood. A normal childhood is 18 years.
That's the strawman: I've not said anywhere in the thread bioroids should or would have a normal childhood, or what a normal childhood would be.

And that's because there's so much variety in the US today, "a normal childhood is 18 years" would pejoratively imply abnormality for millions who took on adult responsibilities or had them imposed at 15, 16, 17, 19, 20, or 21, despite being otherwise personally healthy in mind and body and accepted and functional in their society, making it dubious as a definition of normality. When world wide cultural scope and a century of social change is added in, it's utterly dubious what "childhood experiences of a typical 4th or 5th wave human child" would be.

Now, I would rather not continue to plague the thread with our differences. If anyone else has any questions about what I mean, please ask, otherwise I'd like to drop it and leave two posters aggravated instead of all of them.
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Old 01-21-2014, 11:42 AM   #172
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Default Re: Ziusudra / Nyx questions

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Originally Posted by jeff_wilson View Post
That's the strawman:
I'm not as versed in logic and rhetoric as you are, but I don't think it can be a strawman if it's what I honestly understand as your position. I'm not creating a caricature of your position and attacking that; I am trying to understand what it is you actually think. This isn't a debate and I don't care if I "lose".
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I've not said anywhere in the thread bioroids should or would have a normal childhood, or what a normal childhood would be.
I've understood you to have. When I asked if it was a normal childhood, you said "How is not a normal childhood?". When I gave an illustrative example of events of a normal childhood you responded that each was important enough to include, with no clarification that you weren't saying the entire existence of which my examples were meant to be representative is important in totality.

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And that's because there's so much variety in the US today, "a normal childhood is 18 years" would pejoratively imply abnormality for millions who took on adult responsibilities or had them imposed at 15, 16, 17, 19, 20, or 21, despite being otherwise personally healthy in mind and body and accepted and functional in their society, making it dubious as a definition of normality. When world wide cultural scope and a century of social change is added in, it's utterly dubious what "childhood experiences of a typical 4th or 5th wave human child" would be.
Yes, but TS is a GURPS game and game mechanically "adulthood" begins at 18.

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Now, I would rather not continue to plague the thread with our differences. If anyone else has any questions about what I mean, please ask, otherwise I'd like to drop it and leave two posters aggravated instead of all of them.
I would just like to understand how you actually think it works, in positive statements, rather than rebuttals to my version. I suspect it's the same as mine and I've just failed to communicate it clearly, but I can't tell, because I don't have a clue at this point what your version is.
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Old 01-21-2014, 02:06 PM   #173
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Default Re: Ziusudra / Nyx questions

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Originally Posted by sir_pudding View Post
I would just like to understand how you actually think it works, in positive statements, rather than rebuttals to my version. I suspect it's the same as mine and I've just failed to communicate it clearly, but I can't tell, because I don't have a clue at this point what your version is.
As before, I don't want to continue crapping the thread with our differences. I will, however, take it to a thread where we can examine the parameters of bioroid development and maturity, hopefully it will be drenched in textev and citations and other, more objective items.
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Old 05-02-2023, 08:11 PM   #174
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Default Re: Ziusudra / Nyx questions

“Immunity to Disease” was replaced with “Resistant to Disease (+8)” in the Gilgamesh in 4e Bio-Tech.

“Immunity to Disease” was replaced with “Resistant to Disease (+8)” in the Herakles in 4e TS - Bioroid Bazaar & 4e Bio-Tech

But, Ziusudra in TS - Changing Times still has “Immunity to Disease”. Is this a mistake?
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Old 05-02-2023, 08:36 PM   #175
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Default Re: Ziusudra / Nyx questions

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“Immunity to Disease” was replaced with “Resistant to Disease (+8)” in the Gilgamesh in 4e Bio-Tech.

“Immunity to Disease” was replaced with “Resistant to Disease (+8)” in the Herakles in 4e TS - Bioroid Bazaar & 4e Bio-Tech

But, Ziusudra in TS - Changing Times still has “Immunity to Disease”. Is this a mistake?
Probably an artifact of works in progress. I think Changing Times came out before Bio-tech 4e and definitely before Bioroid Bazaar.

Changing Times has stuff not in UT 4e too.
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Old 05-03-2023, 08:37 AM   #176
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Default Re: Ziusudra / Nyx questions

Even leaving aside the sequence and timing of events in the two different writing processes involving two different authors, so far as I was concerned, Transhuman Space (4th edition version) diverged from the generic background(s) implied by Bio-Tech and Ultra-Tech for 4th edition. You'll doubtless find all sorts of "inconsistencies", which are absolutely no such thing, because there's no reason to expect consistency.

Of course, you're perfectly free to ignore anything and everything in Changing Times and use templates and equipment lists from the 4e Tech books instead. The games police aren't taking my calls at the moment. Not since I used the guns list from Ultra-Tech in my own last TS campaign.

(In regard to that specific template -- I evidently went for maximum inter-edition consistency there, though that was in retrospect possibly a mistake. Immunity to Disease is not really a realistic option for a biological organism; a very good immune system is one thing, an infallible one is quite another. 4e gave David the option to make it "merely" a +8, and he took it. I should have done the same.)
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Last edited by Phil Masters; 05-03-2023 at 08:41 AM.
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Old 05-03-2023, 09:42 AM   #177
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Default Re: Ziusudra / Nyx questions

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Originally Posted by Phil Masters View Post
Even leaving aside the sequence and timing of events in the two different writing processes involving two different authors, so far as I was concerned, Transhuman Space (4th edition version) diverged from the generic background(s) implied by Bio-Tech and Ultra-Tech for 4th edition. You'll doubtless find all sorts of "inconsistencies", which are absolutely no such thing, because there's no reason to expect consistency.

Of course, you're perfectly free to ignore anything and everything in Changing Times and use templates and equipment lists from the 4e Tech books instead. The games police aren't taking my calls at the moment. Not since I used the guns list from Ultra-Tech in my own last TS campaign.

(In regard to that specific template -- I evidently went for maximum inter-edition consistency there, though that was in retrospect possibly a mistake. Immunity to Disease is not really a realistic option for a biological organism; a very good immune system is one thing, an infallible one is quite another. 4e gave David the option to make it "merely" a +8, and he took it. I should have done the same.)
Thank You, so much, for clearing that up! Thank You!
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