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Old 04-01-2024, 11:08 PM   #1
King Leonidas
 
Join Date: Aug 2023
Default Cheap armour? what's the drawback?

other than the minus 1-dr? what is the drawback. i can't seem to find anything? GM said something along the lines of hot cheap armor breaks easier. i could not find anything in magic about this either? is it in the crit table?
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Old 04-02-2024, 12:22 AM   #2
Anthony
 
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Default Re: Cheap armour? what's the drawback?

The drawback is -1 DR. There aren't any rules for armor breakage (cheap weapons break easier).
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Old 04-02-2024, 12:37 AM   #3
Christopher R. Rice
 
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Default Re: Cheap armour? what's the drawback?

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Originally Posted by King Leonidas View Post
other than the minus 1-dr? what is the drawback. i can't seem to find anything? GM said something along the lines of hot cheap armor breaks easier. i could not find anything in magic about this either? is it in the crit table?
Maybe they meant it's got a HT penalty? Most armor has HT 12.

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The drawback is -1 DR. There aren't any rules for armor breakage (cheap weapons break easier).
That's not true. Damage to Armor is in GURPS Low-Tech Companion 2: Weapons and Warriors, p. 25.
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Old 04-02-2024, 01:16 AM   #4
King Leonidas
 
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Default Re: Cheap armour? what's the drawback?

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Originally Posted by Christopher R. Rice View Post
Maybe they meant it's got a HT penalty? Most armor has HT 12.



That's not true. Damage to Armor is in GURPS Low-Tech Companion 2: Weapons and Warriors, p. 25.
yeah but where is that? i don't think hes tracking armour damage
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Old 04-02-2024, 02:07 AM   #5
Phil Masters
 
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Default Re: Cheap armour? what's the drawback?

The -1 DR should be penalty enough, in gamist terms. Armour is usually the thing that pushes you hardest towards higher encumbrance bands, so you really want to get the best protection you can from it.

Other potential real-world problems with cheap armour really need nit-picky grubby-realism rules. Persistent mild discomfort, maintenance problems, restricted arcs of movement and view… I suspect that GMs maybe shouldn’t allow cheap armour unless they’re prepared to referee that stuff.
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Old 04-02-2024, 05:43 AM   #6
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Default Re: Cheap armour? what's the drawback?

Wasn't there something under munition plate for it having an encumbrance penalty as well as reduced DR? Presumably in Low -Tech if anyone has a copy to hand?
Realistically, poorly fitting armour (which this represents) would be what people actually notice - you don't notice the reduced DR at least until it's too late, whilst heavy, poorly made stuff that needs constant repairs is with you every step of the campaign.
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Old 04-02-2024, 06:05 AM   #7
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Default Re: Cheap armour? what's the drawback?

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Wasn't there something under munition plate for it having an encumbrance penalty as well as reduced DR? Presumably in Low -Tech if anyone has a copy to hand?
Realistically, poorly fitting armour (which this represents) would be what people actually notice - you don't notice the reduced DR at least until it's too late, whilst heavy, poorly made stuff that needs constant repairs is with you every step of the campaign.
Cheap armor isn't poorly-fitting, it just isn't tailored (and thus isn't as comfortable, but that's generally below GURPS resolution). Good-quality and better armor has to be tailored for the wearer (Good can be adjusted to fit someone else by a competent armourer, but better armor is useless to anyone but the original owner and someone who is nearly-identical), but munitions armor, pretty much by definition, is one-size-fits-most. That's a big part of why it's heavier per point of DR (cheaper materials also often factor in). The only thing I can think of related to lower-quality having something like an encumbrance penalty is an optional rule from Low Tech Instant Armor, where IIRC rigid upper leg armor that isn't Expertly Tailored or better gives a -1 to DX (akin to a layering penalty) due to it restricting the way legs can move.

In addition to the -1 to DR (which is a serious drawback on its own), I believe Low Tech has Cheap armor have larger armor chinks/gaps, making them easier to target (by contrast, Expertly Tailored and Masterfully Tailored, in addition to weight reduction, have smaller chinks/gaps, making them harder to target). As already noted, Cheap artifacts in general have lower HT than Good and better artifacts, and I believe they typically have less HP as well. But I'll note that, even without the HT and HP reduction, Cheap armor would still be easier to damage (and thus break) than Good or better - the rules for damage to armor in LTC2 have the armor protected by its own DR at -1, so DR 3 Good plate armor is protected by DR 2 while DR 2 Cheap plate armor (same weight as the above) would only be protected by DR 1.
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Old 04-02-2024, 09:07 AM   #8
Fred Brackin
 
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Default Re: Cheap armour? what's the drawback?

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Originally Posted by King Leonidas View Post
yeah but where is that? i don't think hes tracking armour damage
https://www.sjgames.com/gurps/books/...ch/companion2/

If your GM isn't using this pdf you probably don't have to worr about cheap armor being easier to damage. If this is for that super low TL campaign you've talked about in the past the concept shouldn't apply that much.
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Old 04-02-2024, 09:28 AM   #9
pawsplay
 
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Default Re: Cheap armour? what's the drawback?

-1 DR is a pretty decent penalty, but I think I would also reduce the penalty for targeting chinks in the armor by 1.
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Old 04-02-2024, 11:19 AM   #10
Rupert
 
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Default Re: Cheap armour? what's the drawback?

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Originally Posted by pawsplay View Post
-1 DR is a pretty decent penalty, but I think I would also reduce the penalty for targeting chinks in the armor by 1.
Low-Tech goes the other way - really well fitted armour ("Expert Tailoring") makes the penalty -1 more.
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