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Old 09-23-2024, 12:01 AM   #1
David Bofinger
 
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Default Armour Blocks Some Dice

The post on partial armour made me think about how armour works in TFT. One problem is that armour can make you invincible against some foes. I wondered if there was a way to implement armour differently in TFT, without particularly making it more complex.

Idea: Armour blocks some damage die rolls, or at least reduces them.

Effects:
  • We can if we choose implement partial armour by having different parts of the body represented by the numbers reduced. For instance, a very good helmet might change any 6 to a 1, while a light helmet reduces any 6 to a 4.
  • We can implement the difference between a bastard sword (good against armoured targets) and a sabre (good against unarmoured targets) by giving them different numbers of dice. Or, if we're feeling heretical, different kinds of dice.
  • Armour is no longer completely protective (unless we want it to be): some numbers are likely to get through.
Issues:
  • A 2d weapon is now inferior to a 1d+3 weapon so the weapon chart would have to change a lot.
  • The damage system was supposed to capture lots of things and we've pushed it back to just handling hit location, that's not so good.
Anyone got any thoughts?

Last edited by David Bofinger; 09-23-2024 at 08:40 AM. Reason: typo that confused Shostak
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Old 09-23-2024, 05:38 AM   #2
Shostak
 
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Default Re: Armour Blocks Some Dice

Quote:
Originally Posted by David Bofinger View Post
For instance, a very good helmet might change any 6 to a 1, while a light helmet reduces any 6 to a 1.[*]
Do you mean that a light helmet reduces exactly one 6 result to a 1, as opposed to a very good helmet which changes all sixes to ones?
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Old 09-23-2024, 08:36 AM   #3
David Bofinger
 
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Default Re: Armour Blocks Some Dice

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shostak View Post
Do you mean that a light helmet reduces exactly one 6 result to a 1, as opposed to a very good helmet which changes all sixes to ones?
I didn't mean that, I meant to say the light helmet reduced 6s to 3s or something like that and mistyped. But your way might also work. It would give the feeling that light armour is fine against light weapons. It would make doubles a terrifying thing, which might not make sense. There's a lot of ways to do this. The ones I see at the moment don't work right but a bit more thought might change that.

Last edited by David Bofinger; 09-23-2024 at 08:39 AM. Reason: Misunderstood question
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Old 09-23-2024, 10:11 AM   #4
hcobb
 
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Default Re: Armour Blocks Some Dice

Have armor add dice instead.
Cloth armor stops 1d-3 hits. (All of these are never less than zero)
Leather armor stops 1d-2 hits.
Chain stops 2d-4 hits.
And so on.
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Old 09-23-2024, 10:42 AM   #5
TippetsTX
 
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Default Re: Armour Blocks Some Dice

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Originally Posted by hcobb View Post
Have armor add dice instead.
Cloth armor stops 1d-3 hits. (All of these are never less than zero)
Leather armor stops 1d-2 hits.
Chain stops 2d-4 hits.
And so on.
I can't see how that improves gameplay. No more dice rolls please.
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Old 09-23-2024, 11:21 AM   #6
Shostak
 
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Default Re: Armour Blocks Some Dice

I am sympathetic to the idea that lightly armed combatants could use some help getting their attacks through armor. But I wonder if allowing bypass penalties to the attack roll is better.
  • Make a standard attack roll: armor stops its full protection rating
  • Attack at -3DX to bypass half of armor's protection rating (round down)
  • Attack at -6DX bypass all of armor's protection rating

I think that this reflects both how armor actually works and how weapons can be wielded to work around armor. Those misericordes worked well, but needed to be aimed carefully.

It might be worth capping adjDX at 8 or even 7 for such attacks , to keep high-DX figures from being too advantaged. It should be hard to get past someone's armor!
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Old 09-23-2024, 12:04 PM   #7
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Default Re: Armour Blocks Some Dice

Quote:
Originally Posted by Shostak View Post
I am sympathetic to the idea that lightly armed combatants could use some help getting their attacks through armor. But I wonder if allowing bypass penalties to the attack roll is better.
  • Make a standard attack roll: armor stops its full protection rating
  • Attack at -3DX to bypass half of armor's protection rating (round down)
  • Attack at -6DX bypass all of armor's protection rating

I think that this reflects both how armor actually works and how weapons can be wielded to work around armor. Those misericordes worked well, but needed to be aimed carefully.

It might be worth capping adjDX at 8 or even 7 for such attacks , to keep high-DX figures from being too advantaged. It should be hard to get past someone's armor!
I have a similar rule for this called 'Finding the Soft Spot'. A figure may make a targeted attack against an armored opponent w/ the goal of hitting them someplace where the armor provides less protection. This vulnerability is harder to find or access in heavier armors so the penalty is specific to each category of armor... -3 DX when attempting this kind of strike against foes in LIGHT armor, -6 DX vs. MEDIUM armor and -9 vs. HEAVY armor. A successful strike will bypass half (rounded down) of the armor's protection. I also have talents which improve these odds.
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Old 09-23-2024, 12:16 PM   #8
David Bofinger
 
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Default Re: Armour Blocks Some Dice

Quote:
Originally Posted by hcobb View Post
Have armor add dice instead.
Would that also be a way to address partial coverage in armour? Two kinds of armour have the same penalty, one has a better mean, the other a smaller standard deviation? Maybe not enough resolution.
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Old 09-24-2024, 03:33 AM   #9
Steve Plambeck
 
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Default Re: Armour Blocks Some Dice

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Originally Posted by TippetsTX View Post
I also have talents which improve these odds.
If I ever fiddled with this idea at all, I'd use your approach. Probably: an expert with a weapon can bypass 2 hits of their target's armor, and a master with a weapon can bypass 3 or 4 hits. 4 sounds a little too extreme though.
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Old 09-24-2024, 08:57 AM   #10
Shostak
 
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Default Re: Armour Blocks Some Dice

[QUOTE=TippetsTX;2538220]
Quote:
A successful strike will bypass half (rounded down) of the armor's protection. I also have talents which improve these odds.
RAW gives us talents that improve the odds: the Expert and Master weapon talents. Do you replace those, or do you have additional talents that stack with those?
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