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Old 08-07-2012, 05:09 PM   #31
sir_pudding
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Default Re: Do allies earn CP?T

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Masters View Post
No. Only PCs can have Allies, and Allies are always NPCs.
That's what B37 says but it's weirder than that in practice. Clearly NPCs can have the same summoning abilities that PCs have, even if they are based on Allies. Several published NPCs have normal (non-summonable) Allies (for example several of the Monsters in GURPS Fantasy); which seems to directly contradict B37. Lastly, you'd be the guy to ask, but how do NPC infomorphs with multiple shells work?

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Originally Posted by benz72 View Post
This was the answer I was expecting but failed to find it explicitly prohibited.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by B37
Only PCs who take NPCs as
Allies pay points for the privilege. Two
PCs can be mutual “allies” for free, as
can two NPCs – and NPCs never pay
points for PCs as Allies. An Ally is
specifically a skilled NPC associate for
one PC.
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Old 08-11-2012, 11:50 AM   #32
Figleaf23
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Default Re: Do allies earn CP?

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Originally Posted by benz72 View Post
Next question,
Can allies have 'subordinate allies'?

Can Adam buy Beth as an ally if Beth already has Carl as an ally? If so what is Adam's relation to Carl? What if Beth acquires Carl as an ally during play?
The GM makes up Allies.

The GM can give them Allies if s/he wants.
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Old 08-11-2012, 11:52 AM   #33
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Default Re: Do allies earn CP?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phil Masters View Post
No. Only PCs can have Allies, and Allies are always NPCs.

There's a reason for that rule. The abuses are tiresomely obvious otherwise.

That 'rule' is actually apocryphal.

And there is no potential for abuse since it's the GM who makes up Ally sheets.

Quote:
Only PCs who take NPCs as
Allies pay points for the privilege. Two
PCs can be mutual “allies” for free, as
can two NPCs – and NPCs never pay
points for PCs as Allies. An Ally is
specifically a skilled NPC associate for
one PC.
While the final sentence suggests Allies are only for PCs, IMO it doesn't clearly prohibit it.

Last edited by Figleaf23; 08-11-2012 at 11:58 AM.
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Old 08-11-2012, 12:27 PM   #34
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Default Re: Do allies earn CP?

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Originally Posted by benz72 View Post
Next question,
Can allies have 'subordinate allies'?

Can Adam buy Beth as an ally if Beth already has Carl as an ally? If so what is Adam's relation to Carl? What if Beth acquires Carl as an ally during play?
The extreme cost savings and confusing character sheets that result make it inadvisable for a GM to design an ally with subsidiary allies. If the player asks for an ally with a concept that absolutely calls for a second ally (Like Stan The Dragon-Rider), then I would recommend giving the character that second ally with a discount for "granted by ally"
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Old 08-11-2012, 01:09 PM   #35
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Default Re: Do allies earn CP?

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Originally Posted by David Johnston2 View Post
The extreme cost savings and confusing character sheets that result make it inadvisable for a GM to design an ally with subsidiary allies. If the player asks for an ally with a concept that absolutely calls for a second ally (Like Stan The Dragon-Rider), then I would recommend giving the character that second ally with a discount for "granted by ally"
That doesn't quite line up. That implies the PC has a second ally that can only show up if the first one does. And that the second ally is the PC's ally, not only the ally's ally. That dragon might hate the PC but is loyal to the ally, which couldn't work if it was bought with "Granted by Ally".
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Old 08-11-2012, 03:39 PM   #36
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Default Re: Do allies earn CP?

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Originally Posted by Figleaf23 View Post
While the final sentence suggests Allies are only for PCs, IMO it doesn't clearly prohibit it.
The final sentence of the excerpt, OTOH, does explicitly limit Allies such that it is not a trait that an NPC could have.
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Old 08-11-2012, 03:42 PM   #37
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Default Re: Do allies earn CP?

One of my characters had Pegasus Knight allies who themselves had Pegasus Allies, it worked out okay
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Old 08-11-2012, 04:14 PM   #38
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Default Re: Do allies earn CP?

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Originally Posted by cmdicely View Post
The final sentence of the excerpt, OTOH, does explicitly limit Allies such that it is not a trait that an NPC could have.
I don't think so. I believe it should be read in the context of justifying the preceding sentences about points, rather than as a stand-alone prohibition against GM choice (which would be uncharacteristic of GURPS, and if intended would likely be made explicit).
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Old 08-11-2012, 04:26 PM   #39
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Default Re: Do allies earn CP?

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Originally Posted by kirbwarrior View Post
That doesn't quite line up. That implies the PC has a second ally that can only show up if the first one does.
He does.




Quote:
And that the second ally is the PC's ally, not only the ally's ally.
Because it is.



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That dragon might hate the PC but is loyal to the ally, which couldn't work if it was bought with "Granted by Ally".[
Works just fine. Allies don't have to like you.
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Old 08-11-2012, 06:25 PM   #40
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Default Re: Do allies earn CP?

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Originally Posted by Figleaf23 View Post
That 'rule' is actually apocryphal.

And there is no potential for abuse since it's the GM who makes up Ally sheets.



While the final sentence suggests Allies are only for PCs, IMO it doesn't clearly prohibit it.
The entire quoted section says, repeatedly, and in several different ways, that two NPCs can be "allied" but not Allies. They can team up, but one doesn't have the advantage that guarentees the other will remain friends and show up to help a certain frequency of the time. That's what Ally is after all.
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