Corco's Villa (IC)

[the_matrix_walker]

Spoiler:  

Originally Posted by ericthered

Fair enough. I had thought he had sworn his oath, and you had sworn your suggested oaths. If you want him to have sworn the two-fold oath, he can have sworn that as well, in addition to the prize oath.

That doesn't seem to make sense... We never got to the pact itself. He didn't offer us anything. What are we getting in the contract? We only talked about the ramifications of breaking it.

The words quoted were what I thought were exact.

They are suggestions and incomplete bits of conversation and they don't make sense to me if they are just strung together. An agreement would need goals, limitations and terminal conditions as well, we are not going to agree to assist him forever in whatever he wants for as long as he does not act dishonorably to us. It would be unwise to have different oaths... we would all be making the same oath to meet our goals. If there was any possibility this was going to be a game of "GOTCHA!" this really should have been done in more detail than "oaths are made."

But if you attack first, does that change the betrayer from him to you?

Logic would seem to dictate otherwise...I would not think so. Once the pact is broken, the ramifications apply and that's that. Once the vessel has broken, it carries no more liquid... Once the rope is cut, the creature is unbound...

Unless his actions so far do not constitute a dishonorable action or a breaking of the (unspecified) pact. If he were in fact disabled and apparently murdered through no subterfuge of his own, and able to survive somehow and just has not had the ability to inform us, we may have a different situation. "GOTCHA!"

Unless there is something we don't understand... Which isn't too far fetched since we don't know what what the wording is and it's magic we don't know any of the rules for.

You didn't swear the "honorably" oath, he did...

What did we swear to then? So did we swear to the suggestions you quoted only, or was Vassarious' mutual disappointment one as well? What was the content of the referred to pact? If we are in an oath that says if we break our pact, bad things happen, we need to know what the pact itself is.

Sounds like you're pretty confident you're all good!

I was.

Realizing I apparently have no clear idea what we agreed to between the panels is making me suddenly concerned. It is not... pleasing.

If we are somehow the ones in violation and we act against him and are double-harmed, we will need to get away and shake a spear to get others to take him down "as Fated".

I'd say you're pretty darn close.

Since you are the GM, who knows things we do not, that is good to hear.

From where I am sitting, we have no evidence that Yi is even our guy, we're working on pure speculation going after a guy with whom we have a vague pact ready to bite us on the ass. We still have bupkis but headaches and problems!

TLDR:
There is insufficient information in the quotations to make a sensible Oath/Bond/Deal.

We neither made, nor saw, any oaths made with Yi in character, only had you allude to them. So I think we need to know the exact content of any oaths we made or received.

[ericthered]

Yi made the oaths without realizing they were going to be broken as well. The aim is suprize, not "Gotcha!"

The exact wording is this (I've tweaked Yi and Halcyone a tiny bit to put them in first person)

Yi:
"I swear by my prize that I will deal with you honorably"

Halcyone:
"If I break our agreement may my former master find me"

Vassarious:
"May any harm a betrayer of this pact inflicts be answered twofold in kind upon themselves"

If you have further questions you may roll Thaumatology! to get answers.



I hope this helps.

[the_matrix_walker]

Occult! What are the contents of "this pact"?

3d6 <= 14
1 + 4 + 4 = 9 ... success

[TGLS]

Originally Posted by ericthered

Halcyone:
"If I break our agreement may my former master find me"

Are these pacts strong enough to give worlds with no knowledge of interworld travel knowledge? Or cross worlds at all?

[the_matrix_walker]

Originally Posted by the_matrix_walker

Occult! What are the contents of "this pact"?

3d6 <= 14
1 + 4 + 4 = 9 ... success

I'm not trying to be obtuse...

the "honorable" thing for Yi was meant to be the only oath when Vassarious says it, they wanted to avoid oaths (and just go for a drink, because it's all sticky-traps and screw this).

Then when you gave the "pact" quote in the OOC (as our not getting our prize, the same as Yi, was not acceptable), which I copied "by divine inspiration" I likewise, thought that would be the only oath that we all took together, once we had worked out the pact. And then we skipped all that, which I did not argue with at the time having presumed we worked out the details.

So at this point, I just want to know what we actually agreed to.

[ericthered]

Originally Posted by the_matrix_walker

Occult! What are the contents of "this pact"?

• Do each other no harm
• Do not intentionally let each other come to harm
• Work together to achieve your mutual objective

Originally Posted by TGLS

Are these pacts strong enough to give worlds with no knowledge of interworld travel knowledge? Or cross worlds at all?

No. This magic doesn't cross worlds.

Originally Posted by the_matrix_walker

I'm not trying to be obtuse...

the "honorable" thing for Yi was meant to be the only oath when Vassarious says it, they wanted to avoid oaths (and just go for a drink, because it's all sticky-traps and screw this).

Then when you gave the "pact" quote in the OOC (as our not getting our prize, the same as Yi, was not acceptable), which I copied "by divine inspiration" I likewise, thought that would be the only oath that we all took together, once we had worked out the pact. And then we skipped all that, which I did not argue with at the time having presumed we worked out the details.

So at this point, I just want to know what we actually agreed to.

Sorry, I thought V was just concerned about what V would be promising.

[the_matrix_walker]

Originally Posted by ericthered

• Do each other no harm
• Do not intentionally let each other come to harm
• Work together to achieve your mutual objective

So what happens when the pact appears to have a paradox?
We do not appear to have a mutual objective. Vassarious' objective is to fulfil the fate he was sent here for.

Originally Posted by ericthered

Sorry, I thought V was just concerned about what V would be promising.

Vassarious was trying to get out of vowing entirely or keeping it as light and simple as possible and after getting shot down I just went with your suggestion to keep things moving.

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Okay, so we can't harm each other...

So let's see if we can find him and talk. If Vassarious adapts to detect supernatural, can they get a ping? Can I put long ranged on it?

[ericthered]

Originally Posted by the_matrix_walker

So what happens when the pact appears to have a paradox?

Then that part of the pact is fulfilled and carries no further obligations... though the intent of the parties matters more than the truth.


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Okay, so we can't harm each other...

So let's see if we can find him and talk. If Vassarious adapts to detect supernatural, can they get a ping? Can I put long ranged on it?

Supernatural creatures, supernatural effects, and magical casters are all over the place around here.

Can you stick long ranged on it?.... yes.

Farther away from the Estate, Vassarius has a little more luck, and thinks he located Yi's general direction.


How will you approach him?

[TGLS]

Originally Posted by ericthered

How will you approach him?

I say we overfly him to see what this Yi looks like, and if he has any distinguishing possessions.

[the_matrix_walker]

I'm assuming the third point is dissolved and only the first two apply, as Vassarious was always highly skeptical in speech and action of Bel being the target, and this being a means to an end to bring them closer to their proper destiny.


Unless Halycone objects, I say we just fly up and say hi.