'Shotguns have dkb/dbt' - where did that myth (?) come from?

[Kromm]

Usual estimates for punches assume about 1/6 the striker's mass, if the striker is leaning into the blow. Good punches aren't "whip cracks" that channel tons of energy into a hand. Good punches are closer to battering rams that have the entire arm, shoulder, and upper quarter of the torso behind them. An uppercut can do significantly better.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Kromm

Usual estimates for punches assume about 1/6 the striker's mass, if the striker is leaning into the blow. Good punches aren't "whip cracks" that channel tons of energy into a hand. Good punches are closer to battering rams that have the entire arm, shoulder, and upper quarter of the torso behind them. An uppercut can do significantly better.

What would be the in-game difference between the two? One as a Defensive Attack or what?

[Anthony]

Originally Posted by Kromm

Good punches aren't "whip cracks" that channel tons of energy into a hand. Good punches are closer to battering rams that have the entire arm, shoulder, and upper quarter of the torso behind them.

In that case, reduce the '7 m/s' figure to 2-3 m/s, since your torso velocity is going to be around your step velocity and your shoulder velocity isn't going to be dramatically higher. There's a lot of options for how the energy is delivered, but the total impact energy is going to be in the 25-50J range for an average person.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Anthony

In that case, reduce the '7 m/s' figure to 2-3 m/s, since your torso velocity is going to be around your step velocity and your shoulder velocity isn't going to be dramatically higher. There's a lot of options for how the energy is delivered, but the total impact energy is going to be in the 25-50J range for an average person.

Wrong again, I think. There's step velocity, relative to which there is the relative torso velocity, relative to which is the relative arm velocity. It all adds up.

[Kromm]

Originally Posted by Anthony

In that case, reduce the '7 m/s' figure to 2-3 m/s, since your torso velocity is going to be around your step velocity and your shoulder velocity isn't going to be dramatically higher. There's a lot of options for how the energy is delivered, but the total impact energy is going to be in the 25-50J range for an average person.

I don't disagree. What's important is really more the momentum difference . . . 1 kg at 7 m/s is 7 kg-m/s, while closer to 12 kg at 2 to 3 m/s is 24 to 36 kg-m/s, which is enough to make a 72-kg man stumble. A significant part of the self-defense value of a well-thrown punch is that it pushes the assailant away, regardless of whether it hurts him.

[Lord Carnifex]

Also to be remembered is that knock back is a phenomenon that emerges out of the attacker being well anchored vs. a target who is not. Although conservation of momentum and Newton's laws apply, a good punch, kick, or shotgun blast will typically come from someone who is expecting the momentum and whose center of gravity is placed over their foot (feet) and whose body is braced to absorb the momentum of the attack. Meanwhile, the target is not necessarily prepped to receive the jolt of momentum, and so can be knocked down or back because of it.

I've seen Muay Thai and Savate kicks that can accomplish quite a bit of knockback. I can only assume that a shotgun might be able to accomplish similar momentum.