[Help to design] In the 41st millenium there is only...

[Ego Archive]

Originally Posted by naloth

It's easier to see the difference if you list the DR values.
Nanoweave Suit DR18/10 + TL10 Light Clamshell DR 45 (torso)
Monocrys Suit DR24/8 + TL10 Hvy Clamshell DR 60 (torso)

The nanoweave + clamshell does represent flak better. For the carapace I would go the TL Combat Hardsuit (DR 75/45) since that's closer to midway between what armors you've chosen for 5+ and 3+.

I agree that the Hardsuit is probably a better midway point, but I figured that since it is a "sealed" armor, it didn't fit the feel very well.

Originally Posted by naloth

These sounds pretty good other than the Tactical Force Screen. Perhaps the Personal Force Field, but it's no where as good as the Storm Shield (which I think the Force Shield Braclet does a pretty good job of representing).

See, this is where not having played 40k for a decade hindered my conversion. ;)
I totally forgot about the hammer and shield, and the lightning claw combinations. But I seem to think that all Terminator armor has a built in force field, regardless if they have the additional storm shield. Is that not the case?

[Tema69]

Originally Posted by Mr Frost

Far too weakly armoured and armed for the setting ; the obsolete T-72 {real life Russian export tank that was destroyed in huge numbers during the 2 Gulf Wars} in High Tech on P.244 would have it for breakfast with those stats {which means the best modern tanks of today Such as the Abrams , Challanger 2 and Leopard 2 would utterly dominate it} which makes no sense given it is supposed to be far more powerful and advanced than the tanks of today .
[...]
Then upgrade that gun to match with the best A.P. ammunition [...] APFSDSEM -Exotic Matter-

Noooooooo... The whole point of 40k is that their equipment ISN'T that much better than modern stuff. Of course, they have Plasma Weapons, Power Armour, Power Swords, Titans, etc... but these are RARE.
When it comes to the standard equipment, that's massproduced, it's not that great.
Now, I don't know nuthin' about vehicle stats, so I'm not gonna comment on those, but you have to keep in mind that a lot of 40k stuff really sucks, quality-wise.
There's usually always a downside to it too. It might be well-armoured, but then it's really slow. It might have a decent gun, but ammo is unstable, or takes up a lot of space, or it can't fire on the move, etc...

40k is not about "the best AP ammo" or "APFSDSEM". The standard round is HE, and that's it. Some regiments have access to AP, and they're lucky!
The mentality and equipment is much more WW2'ish than "superultraduperhightechninjaarmourpiercing".


---
(I'm not trying to be obnoxious, just trying to clarify some things)

[Tema69]

Originally Posted by Ego Archive

I agree that the Hardsuit is probably a better midway point, but I figured that since it is a "sealed" armor, it didn't fit the feel very well.

Carapace is more or less sealed and protected against that kinda stuff...

Originally Posted by Ego Archive

But I seem to think that all Terminator armor has a built in force field, regardless if they have the additional storm shield. Is that not the case?

Yeah, all termies have a "weak" forcefield, on top of everything else. Balancewise, though, I'd rule that only one could be active - either Stormshield (Sv 3+) or Armour (Sv 5+), if both are worn. Another quirky 40k tech problem - stuff usually doesn't overlap. :D

[cccwebs]

The armor in 40k is very difficult to convert. The saving throw system doesn't translate well to Damage Resistance. After all, Tactical Dreadnaught Armor has an 83% chance to completely stop nearly any type of attack, then a force field that has a 33% chance to stop any attack.

[Tema69]

So, I've covered LasPistols, LasRifles, all portable Bolt Weapons, Flak, Carapace, Power Armour, Chainswords and CCW on page 2.

Lets look at the more primitive weapons requested by the OP.

Autoguns and Autopistols. The standard Autogun would probably simply be the TL9 Assault Carbine, while the standard Autopistol would be a TL9 Heavy Pistol IMO.
Characters or villains could probably get their hands on anything in the Pistol and SMG list (page 137) though, but the other stuff on those lists wouldn't exist, or be more specialised stuff covered later.

The Heavy Stubber could be represented by any standard .50 cal HMG, but let's just assume the one in Characters (B281). Perhaps reduce the weight a little bit, since there are characters carrying it and firing from the hip. 40k-wise, we should assume that it weighs around 75 lb + 25 lb. Tripod.
The UltraTech HMGs are way too powerful to represent a Heavy Stubber.

Autocannons, however, would be nicely covered by UltraTech weaponry. Assuming TL9 Assault Cannon (10d pi++), with Armour Piercing Hardcore Explosive rounds, this adds up to 10d pi++ (2) with Linked 1d cr ex [1d+1].
That's an average of 35 (2) damage plus some explosives and fragmentation. It'll cut easily through Carapace and below (it's AP4 after all), but it'll have a harder time chewing through Power Armour.
But comparing 10d (2) pi++ to the 8d (5) Imp Heavy Bolter, it's still not good enough. We want something dealing more damage than the Heavy Bolter, yet not a Marine killer yet. So let's add ETC to that equation, and we have 15d (2) pi++. That's an average of 52.5 (2) points of pi++ damage. That is starting to get dangerous for Marines, would completely destroy pretty much anything below that, and has a little bit of explosion factor.

Then, comparing it to the Heavy Bolter's Linked 2d cr ex [1d+1], the HB has better explosiveness, so I'm gonna have to reduce it. I'll edit it down to... lets say Linked 1d+1 cr ex [1d]. That gives the Autocannon slightly more fragmentation, but slightly less explosiveness - but a heck of a lot more damage potential.


Gotta run, I'll be back later. :)

Any C&C is appreciated.

[KjetilKverndokken]

Very nice work :), going to be hard to find whats feels best - look foreward to the interpretation of the Baneblade ;-)

I would say that its better to follow the novel for fluff then the sometimes strange rules mechanics of the game.

The Leman Russ has very heavy armour, but is also very big and easy target, with HE rounds as standard.

40k is like WWII but with some equipment that is very advanced.

[Tema69]

"40k is like WWII but with some equipment that is very advanced. "

Exactly! It's more like TL7+2+2 (Imperium) than TL10 or 11. And by +2+2 I mean that there's a lot of TL9 stuff (most military weapons and armour), and a little TL10-11 stuff (Astartes, Force Fields, Titans, etc...).

I'm gonna stay out of vehicle construction though. I'd love to help you guys out with it, but I don't know anything about it yet. I might have to read up on it to help out though. :)

So, how about a Lascannon now?

I'm thinking that a (Field-Jacketed) Semi-Portable X-Ray Laser (12d(5) Burn, Sur) with RoF1 and Shots 1(5). It's ST18M would allow it to be carried by a Devastator Marine.
With that damage, it'd punch through Power Armour, and even penetrate Terminator armour.

Edit: I'll try to roll out an Adeptus Astartes Template now.

[Tema69]

Space Marine of the Adeptus Astartes - Template:

Implants & their related Advantage:
Secondary Heart: Hard to Kill 5 [10];
Ossmodula: Gigantism [0]
Biscopea: ST & HT increase. About ST+6 and HT +4 [100]? That's assuming that the soon-to-be-Marine already has pretty high ST & HT (around 12 at least).
Larraman's Organ & Haemastamen: Regeneration (Slow) [10]
Catalepsean Node: Less Sleep 4 [8]
Preomnor, Multi-lung, Oolitic Kidney: Resistant (+8 HT vs. All Metabolic Hazards) [15]
Omophagea: Mind Reading (only by ingesting) [15]
Occulobe: Night Vision 4 [4]
Lyman’s Ear: Acute Hearing 2 [2]
Sus-an Membrane: Metabolism Control 4 [20]
Melanochrome: Radiation Tolerance 5 [10]
Neuroglottis: Detect (Poisons, Vague) [3]
Mucranoid: Temperature Tolerance 5 (5xHT degrees extra comfort zone) [5]
Betcher’s Gland: Innate Attack (1d Corrosion, 1/2D 1m, Max 2m, RoF 1, Weakened without 1 min Preparation, Costs 1 Fatigue) [4]


Progenoids (Apothecaries will retrieve them upon death, but Traitor marines might want them too)
Black Carapace (Enables advanced life support, targeting, communication, and internal medic functions of Power Armour)

Other Advantages & Disadvantages:
Longevity [2], Reduced Comsumption 2 [4], Rank 2 [10], Patron (Battle Company, Fairly Often) [20]
&
Duty (Extremely Hazardous, All the Time) [-20], Sense of Duty (Chapter) [-10], Code of Honour (Soldier/Codex) [-10], Disciplines of Faith (Asceticism & Ritualism) [-20], Fanaticism (or Extreme Fanaticism) [-15], Intolerance (Xenos, Mutants, Chaos, Traitors, etc, etc...) [-10], Dead Broke [-25]

Skills:
Guns (Gyroc) (E) DX+2 [4], Soldier/TL10 (A) IQ+2 [8], Battlesuit/TL10 (A) DX+3 [12]


Total Template Cost: 176 points.

Cost of Heavy Battlesuit + Helmet, bought as Signature Gear = 9 pts.
Weapon would be issued by Patron, unless it's specific signature gear (such as... the Mastercrafted Powersword given by the now-dead Company Captain).


What do you think?

[KjetilKverndokken]

I think that covers most of it when concering Space Marines :-)

[Tema69]

At least, it represents the bare minimum. A fresh-faced Tactical Marine would probably have...

ST18, DX 12, IQ11, HT16
&
Guns (Gyroc) DX+4 (16), Soldier/TL10 IQ+3 (14), Brawling DX+3 (15)

A Veteran would probably have increased basic abilities, and have 2-5 points more in those skills, as well as numerous more specialized skills (Throwing, Tactics, etc...).

Oh, forgot about the Armour. A Marine would have Battlesuit/TL10, and it would probably be the skill with the highest modifier. I'll add that to my post above.

Edit: Also, looking at the Heavy Battlesuit, there's a few things that'd have to be removed to fit the fluff:
The Electromagnetic Armour thing.
Infrared Cloaking & Radar Stealth.
Basic Move +2 should also be removed. Astartes already have +1 Move from Gigantism, and they aren't particularly fast in the fluff, just endurant.

The Dreadnought Suit (Termie Armour) would need removal of:
The Electromagnetic Armour.
Infrared Cloaking & Radar Stealth.
Basic Move +3 & Super Jump 3.
Actually, fluffwise, Termies can't even run, so adding a Limitation: Can't Sprint would be appropriate.