Unsubduable

[The Benj]

Originally Posted by David Johnston2

Death _checks_ yes but not death. You still die even with Unkillable, although with higher levels you get to come back.

You can still die with Unkillable 1, but with the two higher levels you NEVER die.

Level 2: you are rendered unconscious at -10xHP, but you're not dead.

Level 3: You immediately become an insubstantial being at -10xHP, but you're not dead.

[alaph]

Originally Posted by BonSequitur

That includes immunity to being knocked out but is much broader.

So start there and narrow it up?

[Figleaf23]

Originally Posted by alaph

There is an advantage in the basic book that cost around 150 that is basically immunity from subdual, shock, and a few other things....

Ill look it up after dinner

Supernatural Durability, p.B89.

[pawsplay]

Add ablative DR to taste.

[Figleaf23]

There are several cases of stepped advantages and such that lead to a finally priced absolute version. They might be appropriate models for pricing an absolute level of Hard to Subdue. Consider:

-Resistant thru Immune

-Fearless thru Unfazeable

-Extended Lifespan / Unaging

-Less sleep/Doesn't Sleep

-Extended Duration/Permanent.

[vicky_molokh]

Originally Posted by Kelsan

Er, unless I misunderstand, you can have an Affliction which doesn't allow resistance; It's one of the main uses of the Cosmic enhancement.

What the? Do I have to ask Fade to make a pop-up going directly to 5.2.3 and 5.2.4?

[younglorax]

I'd call it 20 points.

Reason:
-Hard to Subdue is 2pts / level. For most characters, 8 levels of Hard to Subdue means that you're rolling against 18 to avoid falling unconcious. 18 is a nice number, for 3d6.

-Compare to Less Sleep and Doesn't Sleep. Less Sleep costs 2pts / level, and 8 levels of Less Sleep would mean you never have to sleep, if it were allowed. But instead, you're supposed to take Doesn't Sleep, which costs 20 points.

Seems equivalent enough to me.

[PK]

Originally Posted by Molokh

What the? Do I have to ask Fade to make a pop-up going directly to 5.2.3 and 5.2.4?

*shrug* Blame the authors for deciding to name the stupid enhancement "Irresistible Attack". Unfortunately, there are many people in this world who don't bother reading the actual description of something and just judge it by its name alone.

[Not another shrubbery]

Originally Posted by Rev. Pee Kitty

*shrug* Blame the authors for deciding to name the stupid enhancement "Irresistible Attack". Unfortunately, there are many people in this world who don't bother reading the actual description of something and just judge it by its name alone.

...
<<
>>
What?!

heh

Maybe one day I'll collect all the little troublesome bits like that and start a thread "4E Pet peeves" :/

... or has that already been done :?

[NineDaysDead]

Old Thread

Originally Posted by NineDaysDead

Acute Vision costs 2/level.
There are penalties to Vision rolls.
Automatically makes all normal Vision rolls is suggested to cost 15 points.

Fearlessness costs 2/level.
There are penalties to Fright Checks.
Automatically makes all Fright Checks (Unfazable) costs 15 points.

Hard to Subdue costs 2/level.
There are penalties to Consciousness rolls.
Would it be reasonable for “automatically makes all Consciousness rolls” to cost 15 points?

In the case of “Knockdown and Stunning” it would make you immune to the effects of “a failure by 5 or more, or any critical failure”. As for Hazards, you’d be immune to Comas and Unconsciousness (maybe Sleep, as it’s listed under Hard to Subdue, under Advantages that Aid Resistance, Powers page 169), the same way Injury Tolerance: No Vitals makes you immune to Heart Attacks.

EDIT in bold and underlined: Alternatively:
Unconsciousness is an "Affliction", Basic set page 428-429.
Immunity can protect you from “Afflictions” So:

Immunity to All Unconsciousness: Very Common [30].
Immunity to Unconsciousness from Injury: Common [15].
Unconsciousness rolls below 0HP and Unconsciousness from stunning and knockdown rolls, and from some criticals.

Immunity to Unconsciousness from Unconsciousness rolls below 0HP: Occasional [10].
Many cinematic characters seem to have this, they never just lose consciousness for injury, but one good blow can still knock them out.