Fireproof vs. Heat Proof

[Tolenkar]

Hey all,

I am GMing a campaign and some of the characters have the Fireproof spell or fireproof garments. However, they will be going into a situation where there is a lot of steam and high heat (we are talking volcano heat here) above 110 deg F in some rooms and nearing 1,000 deg next to the opening.

The official wording of Fireproofing is that it: "Makes its subject immune to all effects of all kinds of fire and flame."

The main question is whether extreme heat is seen as an effect. In my opinion, Fireproofing should allow you to walk through a small fire and protect fully from any attacks of fire, but not from intense heat. If fireproofing was meant to be that expansive in TFT then a fireproofed item would keep you from getting sunburned, boiled in tar, and give you the ability to swim through lava. I'm pretty sure that's not the intent.

How do other GMs deal with this variance

I think a die roll vs ST every 10 minutes when a character is in an extremely hot environment, for those that don't have fireproofing, will work. Use three dice for the first 30 minutes and add a die every 30 minutes. Failure means the character is fatigued 1 ST and is at a -1 DX. Both penalties are cumulative but the DX penalty caps at a -3. Armor adds its DX minus to every roll. If a character has Fireproofing, I'll just subtract a die for each roll. A critical failure would double the fatigue and DX penalty.

[I]For example, Sir Bedric, with his 12 ST, is wearing chainmail and walks into a steaming tunnel under the volcano where temperatures are in excess of 110 degrees. After 10 minutes, he must make a 3d roll vs. 9 (12-3) or lose 1 ST in Fatigue and is at a -1 DX. If his armor was Fireproof, he would only make a 2d roll vs. 9. On a Critical Failure, he would lose 2 ST in fatigue and be at a -1. DX.


Please let me know how this sounds to you.

-Jim (Tolenkar with ONE "L")

[hcobb]

See the Stalwart spell for protection against non-burning heat.

[Tolenkar]

Originally Posted by hcobb

See the Stalwart spell for protection against non-burning heat.

Thanks, Henry.
Yes, I forgot to mention that Stalwart would also subtract a die. I'm thinking either Stalwart or Fireproofing will subtract a die but they don't add.

[phiwum]

Originally Posted by Tolenkar

I think a die roll vs ST every 10 minutes when a character is in an extremely hot environment, for those that don't have fireproofing, will work. Use three dice for the first 30 minutes and add a die every 30 minutes. Failure means the character is fatigued 1 ST and is at a -1 DX. Both penalties are cumulative but the DX penalty caps at a -3. Armor adds its DX minus to every roll. If a character has Fireproofing, I'll just subtract a die for each roll. A critical failure would double the fatigue and DX penalty.

[I]For example, Sir Bedric, with his 12 ST, is wearing chainmail and walks into a steaming tunnel under the volcano where temperatures are in excess of 110 degrees. After 10 minutes, he must make a 3d roll vs. 9 (12-3) or lose 1 ST in Fatigue and is at a -1 DX. If his armor was Fireproof, he would only make a 2d roll vs. 9. On a Critical Failure, he would lose 2 ST in fatigue and be at a -1. DX.


Please let me know how this sounds to you.

-Jim (Tolenkar with ONE "L")

I think it sounds very reasonable, Tolenkar with ONE "L". It's a good way to model a hostile environment.

[DeadParrot]

Lava is not fire. Neither is steam.
Example: Fireproof would protect subject against a forest fire. But not the burns from sitting on a hot rock in the middle of same fire.

Stalwart seems the spell of choice for this but as already noted, it is just a one die shift to the good, not full protection.

Possible loose clothing and lots of water might be the answer. Seems to work for a lot of the desert folks in hot dry climates. Or going mostly naked, also seems popular in hot humid climates.

[Tolenkar]

Originally Posted by DeadParrot

Lava is not fire. Neither is steam.
Example: Fireproof would protect subject against a forest fire. But not the burns from sitting on a hot rock in the middle of same fire.

Stalwart seems the spell of choice for this but as already noted, it is just a one die shift to the good, not full protection.

Possible loose clothing and lots of water might be the answer. Seems to work for a lot of the desert folks in hot dry climates. Or going mostly naked, also seems popular in hot humid climates.

Yup, I agree on all points. Would you add anything to what I outlined for heat exhaustion?

[DeadParrot]

I would create a Stalwart item and use that instead of Fireproof. At least for the volcano expedition. I don't see a book listed Stalwart item but if Fireproof can be itemized, Stalwart should be able to be itemized also. Might even be a bit lower cost being a IQ10 base spell vs IQ13 for Fireproof.

Depending on how long the trip inside the volcano will take, since Stalwart is good for a day for 3ST, just cast, rest, explore.

Very possible those characters with fireproof items still might get some good out of them. Critters that live in a volcano might just breath/use fire as part of their attacks.

[TippetsTX]

Sounds like an opportunity for a new spell to me...

IQ 17? - ELEMENTAL SHIELD (T)
This spell functions as a super-charged version of STALWART creating a megahex-sized elemental barrier around the spell's target. All figures within this radius are immune to all damage resulting from extreme heat or cold. This includes natural and supernatural sources. Even dragonfire will not effect protected figures for the duration of the spell.

Not sure what the cost should be at the moment, but I'm open to suggestions.

[Bill_in_IN]

Originally Posted by TippetsTX

Sounds like an opportunity for a new spell to me...

IQ 17? - ELEMENTAL SHIELD (T)
This spell functions as a super-charged version of STALWART creating a megahex-sized elemental barrier around the spell's target. All figures within this radius are immune to all damage resulting from extreme heat or cold. This includes natural and supernatural sources. Even dragonfire will not effect protected figures for the duration of the spell.

Not sure what the cost should be at the moment, but I'm open to suggestions.

I suggest a cost of 5 or 6 ST and duration of 12 turns. If you want it to last a day like Stalwart, I would suggest a ST cost of 8 to 10. That's my thought anyway.

[EKB]

Originally Posted by Tolenkar

In my opinion, Fireproofing should allow you to walk through a small fire and protect fully from any attacks of fire, but not from intense heat. If fireproofing was meant to be that expansive in TFT then a fireproofed item would keep you from getting sunburned, boiled in tar, and give you the ability to swim through lava. I'm pretty sure that's not the intent.

How do other GMs deal with this variance

I absolutely allow Fireproofing to be expansive, and it seems natural to me to do so. I won't have it protect against sunburn, since sunburn isn't a "heat" effect but a UV effect, but yes, against being boiled in tar, immersed in lava, or bathed in live steam - or against sunstroke.

Mileage obviously varies here. I see the other views expressed in this thread as peculiarly crabbed, and the other posters no doubt see my view as wildly generous.